LETS TALK BITCOIN

Episode 107 In The Moment

Participants:
Adam B. Levine (AL) Host
Stephanie M!ph" (SM) Co#host
Mi$hae% &e!'%in (M&) (i!e$to! )o! Bit$oin A%%ian$e o) Canada
Emmane% (e%mo%" (E() Co#)onde! and CEO o) BitC!edits
B!ian * (B*) Co#)onde! o) IdeaNotion
Ami! Taa'i (AT) Co!e Bit$oin deve%ope!+ $o!e $o%%a,o!ato! at (a!' -a%%et . Coin/oin
0on (em,o (0() 1onde! and CEO o) 2e!o)ootp!int
E!nest Han$o$' (EH) 0adio host and )onde! o) 31!eedoms &hoeni4
AL: Toda" is Ma" 5th 6789 and this is Episode 87:. This p!o;!am is intended )o!
in)o!mationa% and ed$ationa% p!poses on%". C!"pto$!!en$" is a ne< )ie%d o) std".
Cons%t "o! %o$a% )t!ist+ %a<"e! and investment adviso! ,e)o!e ma'in; an" de$isions
<hatsoeve! )o! "o!se%). =7>8:?
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-e%$ome to Lets Ta%' Bit$oin+ a t<i$e <ee'%" sho< a,ot the ideas+ peop%e and p!oAe$ts
,i%din; the di;ita% e$onom" and the )t!e o) mone". M" name is Adam B. Levine and
toda" <e!e In The Moment. M" )i!st da" in To!onto+ I t!nd%ed do<n to the Bit$oin
(e$ent!a%+ !e$o!de! in to< and dived into the Bit$oinBEthe!em Ha$'athon.
The )i!st ha%) o) toda"s sho< )eat!es se%e$tions )!om that a)te!noon and in$%des
inte!vie<s <ith Mi$hae% &e!'%in )!om the Bit$oin A%%ian$e o) Canada+ Emmane% o)
BitC!edits.io on thei! Bit$oin votin; s"stem+ B!ian o) IdeaNotion on thei! Bit$oin app
)o! Coo;%e C%ass and m" )i!st in pe!son inte!vie< <ith Ami! Taa'i on his Ha$'athon
<innin; (a!' Ma!'et p!oAe$t.
Then+ <e ta'e a %oo' at Cood$oin <ith 2e!o)ootp!int CEO+ 0on (em,o.
The!es mo!e than one <a" to s'in a $at and this ones a non#$!"pto$!!en$" app!oa$h
to Danti)"in; and !e<a!din; ;ood ,ehavio! <ith a E,a!te!F to'en.
1ina%%"+ <e Gip ove! to Ne< Ho!' )o! Stephanies $onve!sation <ith E!nie Han$o$' on
Bit$oin+ his e4$itement a,ot MaidSa)e and the 1!eedom Conne$tion.
EnAo" the sho<I =8>69?
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Adam B. Levine interview with Michael Perlin
AL: Im he!e <ith Mi$hae% &e!'%in+ one o) the di!e$to!s )!om the Bit$oin A%%ian$e o) Canada.
-e!e sittin; in the... <e!e standin; a$ta%%"+ in the Ha$'athon a!ea and eve!"one is
a,so%te%" do<n to the <i!e. Ive done a $op%e o) inte!vie<s he!e ,t eve!"one e%se is ve!"+
ve!" ,s" as the Ad;es ;et !ead" to Ad;e eve!"thin;. Mi$hae%+ "ove ,een he!e the <ho%e
time. Ho!e one o) the o!;aniGe!s o) this event. Can "o te%% s ho< this has ,eenJ -hen
did this event sta!tJ =8>K8?
MP: A%% the vo%ntee!s <ho sta!ted on this sta!ted Dite ea!%" "este!da". M"se%)+ I <o'e p
at K.77am in the mo!nin; to he%p to ;et this sta!ted. Teams sta!ted sho<in; p a,ot... some
ea!%" at :.L7am ,t !ea%%"+ eve!"thin; sta!ted at a,ot M.77am. -e int!od$ed eve!",od"+ <e
too' a %oo' at <hat ideas the" ,!o;ht to the ta,%e+ )o!med some teams and sin$e then+
the"ve ,een ha$'in; a<a" non#stop. =6>8K?
AL: These a!e ad ho$ teams. These a!e teams that did not a!!ive as teams. These a!!ived as
vo%ntee!sJ =6>8N?
MP: Man" teams did $ome <ith thei! )!iends o! thei! $o#<o!'e!s to <o!' to;ethe! ,t the!e
a!e some peop%e <ho sho<ed p so%o+ %oo'in; and hopin; to meet someone <ho <o%d sha!e
thei! vision. The" had an idea+ the" 'ne< the" <o%dnt ;et it done in time on thei! o<n and
the" hoo'ed p <ith othe! peop%e he!e. Its ni$e to see that. =6>LK?
AL: Ho!e one o) the Ad;es o) this event. An" ea!%" )avo!ites "o $an sha!e <ith sJ
=6>LM?
MP: I am one o) the Ad;es. I dont thin' it <o%d ,e )ai! to sha!e an" ea!%" )avo!ites ,t
<hat I $an sa" is that eve!" sin;%e one o) these peop%e have ,een <o!'in; e4t!eme%" ha!d to
;et thei! <o!' done. M" <o!' sta!ts <hen thei! <o!' )inishes and 0sse%% and I he!e a!e
;oin; to ,e doin; the ,est that <e $an to pi$' the ,est teams. =6>K5?
AL: Te!!i)i$I -hat e4a$t%" a!e "o %oo'in; )o! then <hen "o!e ta%'in; a,ot these
p!oAe$tsJ -hats the $!ite!ia that ma'es one ,ette! than anothe!J So )a!+ Ive ta%'ed to
someone <hos desi;nin; a p!i$e )indin; app%i$ation that ses Coo;%e C%ass. I ta%'ed to Ami!
<hos $!eatin; essentia%%" a de$ent!a%iGed Si%' 0oad+ open ma!'et so!t o) thin;. It seems %i'e
the!e is a %ot o) dive!sit" Ast in the t<o that Ive a%!ead" ta%'ed to. -hats the $!ite!iaJ
=L>8M?
MP: Oe!" ;ood point. Ea$h p!oAe$t is di))e!ent and some p!oAe$ts <o!' <ith Bit$oin+ othe!
p!oAe$ts <o!' <ith Ethe!em+ othe! p!oAe$ts dont se eithe!. Its ;oin; to ,e Dite a di))i$%t
Ad;in; p!o$ess ,t <e!e ;oin; to ta'e a %oo' at the idea+ <e!e ;oin; to ta'e a %oo' at ho<
man" peop%e <e!e <o!'in; on the idea. -e!e ;oin; to ma'e s!e that a%% the <o!' <as done
he!e+ o! at %east the maAo!it" o) the <o!' <as done he!e at the Ha$'athon. The %ast thin; <ed
<ant to see is someone <ho had ,een <o!'in; on somethin; )o! si4 monthsP the" %an$h it
he!e and Ast t!" to ;et the p!iGe. Im not ;oin; to sa" its ;oin; to ,e an eas" p!o$ess ,t
ea$h o) s Ad;es+ <e!e ;oin; to ta'e a %oo' at the <o!' thats pt in+ the Da%it" o) the
p!od$t thats $ome ot. Its one thin; to have a ;!eat idea ,t !ea%%"+ the Ha$'athon is a,ot
e4e$tion o) that idea. =L>KN?
AL: E4e$tion is so $!iti$a% in this indst!". Its somethin; that <e see ove! and ove! a;ain+
is that the ideas a$ta%%" a!e eas" and sometimes "o Ast stm,%e ove! them ,e$ase the" a!e
a p!o,%em that needs to ,e so%ved ,t the imp%ementation is !ea%%" the ha!d pa!t. Ho mention
that the p!oAe$ts a!e )o$sin; on Bit$oin o! Ethe!em. -e!e in Bit$oin (e$ent!a% and I 'no<
that Anthon" (i Io!io+ the di!e$to! o) the A%%ian$e o) Canada has a )ondin; !o%e <ithin the
Ethe!em p!oAe$t. Is Bit$oin (e$ent!a%+ o! is the Bit$oin A%%ian$e o) Canada.... a!e "o a,ot
mo!e than Ast Bit$oin no< o! is the )o$s e4pandin;J =9>L7?
MP: Cood Destion. The Bit$oin A%%ian$e o) Canada is )o$sed on Bit$oin in Canada+
ho<eve! the spa$e that <e!e in+ Bit$oin (e$ent!a%+ this is a $o#<o!'in; spa$e that dea%s <ith
a%% t"pes o) de$ent!a%iGed apps+ Ethe!em ,ein; one o) them. The!e a!e a %ot o) peop%e <ho
<o!' ot o) this p%a$e Ast on Ethe!em. -hen the In C!"pto -e T!st Ha$'athon <as ,ein;
)o!med+ 0sse%% tho;ht it <o%d ,e a ;!eat idea to ma'e s!e that a%% t"pes o)
$!"pto$!!en$ies a!e !ep!esented. As %on; as it dea%s <ith $!"pto o! <ith an" 'ind o)
de$ent!a%iGation+ it has a p%a$e he!e at the Ha$'athon. =9>KM?
AL: Has the Bit$oin A%%ian$e o) Canada ta'en an" so!t o) position on Ethe!em ,e"ond the
imp%i$it sppo!t thats ,een ;ivenJ Is the!e an o))i$ia% stan$e o! a tho;ht that the!e <i%% ,e
an o))i$ia% stan$e+ at some pointJ O! is it Ast 'ind o) mo!e )o$sed on Bit$oin and the!e
mi;ht ,e an Ethe!em A%%ian$e o) Canada a%so+ at some point+ ,t thats a di))e!ent thin;J
=K>85?
MP: The Bit$oin A%%ian$e o) Canada hasnt ta'en a stan$e on Ethe!em most%" ,e$ase
Ethe!em hasnt %an$hed "et. -hen the A%%ian$e )o!med+ Bit$oin had ,een a!ond )o! a )e<
"ea!s and <e sa< a need )o! an advo$a$" ;!op to p!omote+ p!ote$t and ed$ate peop%e a,ot
Bit$oin in Canada. -hen Ethe!em %an$hes+ somethin; ve!" simi%a! ma" $!op p o! ma",e
the Bit$oin A%%ian$e o) Canada ma" $hoose to e4pand. Thats somethin; )o! the mem,e!s to
de$ide+ not )o! the di!e$to!s. =K>LN?
AL: Te!!i)i$. Mi$hae%+ so the %ast Destion is+ this is a Ha$'athon its a $ontest. -hat a!e
the p!iGesJ =K>99?
MP: The!e a!e Dite a )e< p!iGes. The!es a Q67+777 p!iGe donated ," BitAn;e%s thats ;oin;
to ;o to the %ead team as Ad;ed ," the Ad;es. The!es a%so a va!iet" o) othe! p!iGes s$h as
OI& ti$'ets to the $on)e!en$e. I 'no< the!e is a Casas$is $oin thats ,een donated )!om
Bit$oins%tants to one o) the teams. The!e a!e a va!iet" o) di))e!ent p!iGes. =5>75?
AL: Coo%+ <e%% this sonds ;!eat. Mi$hae%+ than' "o ve!" m$h )o! "o! time. =5>7N?
MP: Than' "o. =5>88?
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Adam B. Levine interview with Emman!el "elmol#
E": He%%o+ m" name is Emmane% (e%mo%" )!om BitC!edits )!om Mont!ea%. =5>6:?
AL: Im standin; he!e <ith Emmane%. Emmane% is not a$ta%%" pa!ti$ipatin; in a
Ha$'athon. Instead+ he a%on; <ith A%e4+ <ho <eve ta%'ed <ith ,e)o!e a,ot BitC!edits+
have sponso!ed this+ o! a!e one o) the sponso!s and have... Im %oo'in; at a s"stem !i;ht no<
that sa"s 3Oote )o! "o! )avo!ite team and it %ets peop%e vote <ith a$ta% va%e in Bit$oin+
<hi$h is an idea that Ive !ea%%" ,een inte!ested in )o! Dite a %on; time. Can "o ;ive me a
,!ie) ove!vie< o) <hat <e!e %oo'in; at he!e and ho< this <o!'sJ =5>KL?
E": Heah+ e4a$t%". Toni;ht+ <e!e ;oin; to have the vote o) the Ad;e )o! the <innin; team
,t this <i%% ,e the vote o) the p,%i$. The idea is to a%%o< an",od" on the inte!net+ o! d!in;
the E4po+ so this <i%% %ast nti% the end o) the E4po. An",od" <i%% ,e a,%e to send a )e<
,$'s+ o! <hateve! the" <ant+ to the team that the" %i'e. The" vote )o! one o! man" teams.
-eve done a %itt%e ;ami)i$ation o) that+ <hi$h means that i) "o send Q87 to one team+ ha%)
o) it <i%% ;o to a Aa$'pot and ha%) o) it <i%% ;o to the team. The team <i%% have QK <hateve!
happens ,t the othe! QK on the Aa$'pot <i%% ,e <on ," the <innin; team at the end o) the
vote. Thats the $a!!ot that the team <i%% t!" to ;et. The idea is to ,!oad$ast that on T<itte!+
on 0eddit and a%% the team <i%% ta%' to thei! )!iends and <e <ant to sho< ho< $oo% Bit$oin
$an ,e %i'e and ho< $!eative <e $an se ,it$oins+ a$ta%%"+ )o! a votin; s"stem a Di$'+
simp%e votin; s"stem. =:>KM?
AL: Ho< %on; a;o did "o sta!t deve%opin; this s"stemJ =M>77?
E": -e ,i%t that in one da" a$ta%%". Behind that+ the!e is a pa"ment p!o$esso!. BitC!edits+
the app itse%) <e ,i%t that in one da" ,t the pa"ment p!o$esso! ,ehind that... that+ its not a
one da" <o!'+ its a ,i; p%at)o!m ,t <e Ast <ant to sho< that <e $an se that p%at)o!m )o!
$oo% st)). =M>6L?
AL: Besides votin;+ <hat othe! thin;s do "o thin' that somethin; %i'e this $an ena,%e+ o!
not even ,esides votin;+ <hat othe! t"pes o) thin;s do "o thin' that this $o%d ena,%eJ
=M>L6?
E": (e)inite%" ,ein; to<a!d the mi$!o#t!ansa$tions. It ma'es so m$h sense. I $ome )!om
the so$ia% ;ame indst!"+ so I 'no< ho< e))e$tive $an ,e mi$!o#t!ansa$tions and ho< &a"&a%
and $!edit $a!ds s$'s on that. 1o! ne<spape!s+ )o! ,%o;s+ )o! a %ot o) di))e!ent thin;s+ this is
<hat <e !ea%%" <ant to see in the )t!e ,t !i;ht no<+ <e a!e e4p%o!in; a %ot o) ne< $!eative
<a"s to se that ne< di;ita% $ash. =N>75?
AL: Ho mention that the!e <as a ;ami)ied aspe$t o) it that invo%ves this Aa$'pot ,t <hen
"o initia%%" said it+ I <as thin'in; "o <e!e ta%'in; a,ot )o! the se!+ )o! the pe!son <ho
<as donatin;+ o! )o! the pe!son <ho <as tippin; ,t it sonds %i'e this is an additiona% p!iGe
thats %i'e the &eop%es Choi$e a<a!d+ so to spea'. =N>68?
E": Heah. 0i;ht no<+ its a ve!" sma%% ;ami)i$ation and its a%% )o! the team so the" have to
<in+ so that the" <i%% p%a" in a <a" that i) the!e is t<o o! th!ee teams+ %i'e ve!" $%ose to ,e
<innin;+ the" a!e ;oin; to t!" to )ind )!iends to send mo!e ,it$oins to t!" to ;et the Aa$'pot.
Its the )i!st step a$ta%%". =N>98?
AL: I <as ;oin; to as' "o a,ot that. =N>96?
E": -e have a %ot o) ideas a,ot mo!e sophisti$ated ;ami)i$ation. =N>95?
AL: S!e+ "eah. Thats the thin; a,ot these Ha$'athons+ eve!"one <ants to 'eep it simp%e
so that "o $an ;et done <ith the time %imit. That is one Destion that I do have is a,ot the
;ami)i$ation ,e$ase teams $an vote )o! themse%ves+ and "o $ant !ea%%" te%%+ do "o have
an" $on$e!n a,ot that+ o! do "o thin' that eno;h o) the teams <i%% have... =87>76?
E": A%% the teams $an vote )o! themse%ves so its o'. Ho $an vote as man" times as "o
<ant. Its not %i'e "o ta'e one vote and its done. Its a%% a,ot votin; <ith ,it$oins and
t!"in; to $apt!e as man" peop%e... I dont thin' peop%e <i%% vote <ith Q8+777 o! Q6+777. Its
mo!e a,ot ho< man" peop%e "o $an ;athe! and the" need to do that ,e$ase the" have ve!"+
ve!" $oo% p!oAe$ts. I have seen %i'e the!e a!e nine o! ten teams+ nine "este!da" and no< I
thin' the!e is ten ,e$ase the!e <as a sp%it. The" have amaGin;+ amaGin; ideas. The idea
,ehind that is to ,!oad$ast those ideas+ to sho< those ideas+ to sho< that the!e a!e peop%e
t!"in; to innovate on top o) the innovation that is a%!ead" %i'e Bit$oin. =87>96?
AL: Oe!" $oo%. I see that "o!e ;oin; to ,e settin; this p at a <e, site. -hat is the
add!ess i) peop%e <o%d %i'e to visit this and t!" ot the too%J =87>9M?
E": Its not %ive "et ,t it <i%% ,e <<<.Ha$'athon.BitC!edit.io. =87>KK?
AL: OK+ te!!i)i$. This is !ea%%" ;oin; to ta'e a <ee' o! so to ;et ot. Is this sti%% ;oin; to ,e
p at that pointJ =87>KN?
E": Heah+ the" <i%% see the !es%ts ,t a$ta%%" the vote <i%% %ast nti% the end o) the E4po
and the $on$ept. =88>87?
AL: 1ai! eno;h. =88>87?
E": -e!e ;oin; to stop at a!ond 5.77pm on Snda" and then+ a)te! that+ peop%e <i%% see the
votes+ and the <innin; team+ and the p!oAe$t+ and the $onta$t+ i) the" <ant to ta%' <ith those
teams =inadi,%e?. It <i%% %ast the =inadi,%e?. =88>66?
AL: Te!!i)i$. =88>6L?
E": I) it <o!'s+ <e!e ;oin; to o))e! that to an" Ha$'athon a!ond )o! $!"pto$!!en$".
=88>6:?
AL: Emmane%+ than' "o ve!" m$h )o! "o! time. =88>6N?
E": Ho!e <e%$ome. Than' "o Adam. =88>L8?
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Adam B. Levine interview with Brian $!
B$: -e!e )!om a $ompan" $a%%ed IdeaNotion. -e a!e a %o$a% To!onto shop doin;
$ons%tin; so <e ,i%d <e, and mo,i%e apps and as "o $an see+ Im <ea!in; Coo;%e C%ass
!i;ht no<. =88>K5?
AL: I do see that. =88>K:?
B$: -e ,i%d C%ass apps as <e%%. =86>78?
AL: Te%% me a,ot the app%i$ation "o!e ,i%din; )o! the Ha$'athon. -e!e no< on the
)ina% da"+ a $op%e o) ho!s a<a" )!om the dead%ine. -hat did "o ,i%dJ =86>7M?
B$: -e ,i%t a Coo;%e C%ass app )o! ,it$oins. The app $onsists o) th!ee $omponents. One
is a simp%e Bit$oin ti$'e!+ so it ,asi$a%%" sho<s "o the Bit$oin va%e and it pdates
pe!iodi$a%%" ," itse%). The se$ond pa!t is a Bit$oin $a%$%ato!+ so it <i%% $onve!t ten di))e!ent
$!!en$ies so "o $an !ead it to the app+ to "o! C%ass+ and it <i%% $onve!t ten di))e!ent
$!!en$ies into Bit$oin va%es. =86>LL?
AL: Coo%. =86>L9?
B$: The thi!d pa!t is that "o $an !ead it o)) a... se the C%ass $ame!a o)) a p!i$e ta; and then
the app <i%% OC0 it and then $onve!t that a%so into Bit$oin va%es. Hope)%%"+ it ;ives "o
some a$$ess in)o!mation+ I dont 'no<+ to Bit$oin to a%%o< "o to 'no< ho< m$h that is.
=86>K9?
AL: S!e. OC0 means that ,asi$a%%"+ the ma$hine $an !ead it and then it does the $onve!sion
on mass. =86>KM?
B$: E4a$t%"+ e4a$t%". =86>KN?
AL: Ho ;"s sta!ted ,i%din; this a $op%e o) da"s a;oJ Ho< )a! a%on; a!e "oJ A!e "o
happ" <ith the p!oAe$tJ =8L>7K?
B$: -e!e ve!" happ" a,ot the p!oAe$t. A;ain+ <e a!e p!ett" m$h done at this point.
The!e a!e some ,;s <e a!e t!"in; to )i4 and some )ina% sa,i%it" isses+ so!t o) pa" the sto!e
is spposed to ,e at the end as opposed to the )!ont and thin;s %i'e that ,t ove!a%% <e!e
p!ett" happ" and it sho%d ,e p!ett" ;ood. =8L>65?
AL: I see peop%e <a%'in; a!ond <ith Coo;%e C%ass ,t its not !ea%%" somethin; that Ive
done... is this the so!t o) thin; that "o thin' is ;oin; to $at$h onJ (o "o see this st)) in the
)t!eJ =8L>L9?
B$: Hes+ <e de)inite%" thin' so. Coo;%e C%ass and <ea!a,%es+ in ;ene!a%+ as in Coo;%es
annon$ed the <ea!a,%e A&Is+ as <e%% the!e )ie%d sta!t#ps in To!onto a!e doin; a %ot o)
di))e!ent <ea!a,%es+ as <e%%+ s$h as the one Bion"m <ith the <!ist,and that ses "o!
hea!t,eat to $apt!e and athenti$ate "o. Ove!a%%+ a%% the <ea!a,%es <i%% $at$h on and thats
;oin; to ,e the t!end. =89>7L?
AL: I) some,od" has hea!d this inte!vie< and is inte!ested in %ea!nin; mo!e a,ot "o!
$ompan"+ <he!e $an the" ;et in to$h <ith+ <ho sho%d the" ;et invo%ved <ithJ =89>87?
B$: The" $an $onta$t IdeaNotion+ o! Ast !ea$h me B!ianRIdeaNotion.net. =89>8M?
AL: Than' "o ve!" m$h )o! "o! time and <e %oo' )o!<a!d to seein; the !es%ts. =89>68?
B$: Coo%+ than's. =89>66?
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A"%E&T:
K!"ptoKit is the <o!%ds )i!st Ch!ome ,!o<se! Bit$oin <a%%et. Its the easiest+ )astest Bit$oin
<a%%et pa"ment s"stem <ith a simp%e one $%i$' insta%%+ it ta'es Ast se$onds to ;et "o! <a%%et
set p and ,e$ase K!"ptoKit )inds the add!ess and pa"ment )o! "o+ the!es no mo!e )ssin;
a!ond o! ta, s<it$hin;. K!"ptoKit is mo!e than Ast a <a%%et. It $omes <ith a p!e#%oaded
&C& en$!"pted so$ia% net<o!'+ ne<s)eeds )!om 0eddit and Coo;%e and p to date $ha!ts )!om
e4$han;es. 1ina%%"+ K!"ptoKit di!e$to!" a%%o<s "o to ma'e t<o $%i$' pa"ments <ith an" o)
the Bit&a" me!$hants. On$e "o insta%% K!"ptoKit+ "o <ont need an"thin; e%se. 1o! mo!e
in)o!mation+ o! to do<n%oad K!"ptoKit+ visit <<<.K!"ptoKit.$om. =8K>87?
A''()'*EME'T:
Lets Ta%' Bit$oin is hea!d ea$h <ee' ," thosands o) peop%e <ho a!e pa!ti$ipatin; in the
ne< di;ita% e$onom". O! %istene! ,ase o) Bit$oin o<ne!s+ mine!s+ investo!s+ te$hno%o;ists
and me!$hants is ;!o<in; )ast. -e o))e! a %imited nm,e! o) sho!t adve!tisin; s%ots in ea$h
sho< to 'eep o! %istene!s en;a;ed and to p!ovide ma4imm impa$t )o! o! sponso!s. I)
"od %i'e to ta%' to s a,ot Lets Ta%' Bit$oin+ send s an emai% at
sponso!sR%etsta%',it$oin.$om. =8K>98?
@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@
Adam B. Levine interview with Amir Taai
AL: -e!e he!e at the Bit$oin (e$ent!a% Ha$'athon in To!onto+ Canada. This is m" )i!st
time in Canada and Im he!e <ith Ami! Taa'i+ one o) m" )avo!ite peop%e in the Bit$oin spa$e.
=8K>K5?
AT: Ah $ome onI (ont ,i; me p so m$h. =8K>KN?
AL: Oh $ome on. Ho!e the ,i; idea%ist. I %ove the idea%ist side o) this thin; man. Thats
the thin; a,ot it. =85>7L?
AT: Its $oo%. Bit$oins <e%% inte!estin;. Its ve!" di))e!ent isnt itJ Its not one o) these
"ppie thin;s %i'e T<itte!. Its an a$ta% $o!e te$hno%o;" isnt itJ =85>85?
AL: Heah. Thats the thin;. Its a p!oto$o%. Its a p!oto$o% so n%i'e T<itte!+ T<itte! is not a
p!oto$o%. T<itte! has the a,i%it" to ,e in)%en$in; a%% these othe! thin;s. Be)o!e <e ;et o))
into that topi$... =85>65?
AT: -hi$h is a %on; topi$. (La;hte!) =85>6N?
AL: -hi$h is a %on; topi$. (La;hte!) Ho to%d me as soon as I ;ot in that "ove ,een p
a%% ni;ht <o!'in; on this p!oAe$t $a%%ed (a!' Ma!'et. Co%d "o Ast e4p%ain this ,!ie)%" <hat
<e!e %oo'in; at he!eJ =85>LN?
AT: Heah. Its ,asi$a%%" a de$ent!a%iGed Si%' 0oad that $ant ,e sht do<n o! $enso!ed <ith
some p!iva$" )eat!es. Its not %i'e a p!od$tion !ead"... <e Ast did it mo!e as %i'e a p!oo) o)
$on$ept+ a p!otot"pe+ to sho< that its possi,%e. The te$hno%o;" is a%!ead" the!e and it has a%%
the ,asi$ )eat!es that peop%e need to t!ade )!ee%" that <e $an se to $%aim o! sove!ei;nt" as
individa%s+ t!adin; one <ith anothe!. Ho have the )!ont pa;e. =8:>8K?
AL: Im %oo'in; at this and it sa"s 3S,mit De!"+ 3Sea!$h )o! ni$'name so "o $an
sea!$h )o! individa%s on the ma!'etp%a$e. =8:>69?
AT: Heah+ "eah. =8:>6K?
AL: Hove ;ot a pee!s he!e <ith De!" SHA. These peop%e "ove added to "o!... =8:>6N?
AT: No+ no+ no... the ni$'names... the!es %i'e a spe$ia% ,%o$'$hain. That ,%o$'$hain+ ea$h
,%o$' is !e;iste!ed in the Bit$oin ,%o$'$hain and it ;!ops sets o) !e;ist!ations to;ethe! %i'e
that and then em,eds the hash in the Bit$oin ,%o$'$hain. -ith that+ "o $an De!" a mappin;
o) someones ni$'name to some p,%i$ 'e". =8:>K9?
AL: Its %i'e a (NS s"stem )o! p,%i$J =8:>K5?
AT: E4a$t%". &ttin; the pa"ments p!oto$o% into Bit$oin is %di$!os%" stpid idea ,e$ase it
doesnt ,ene)it sma%% ,siness+ it doesnt ,ene)it pee! to pee! t!ans)e!s+ and it doesnt ,ene)it
the ,%a$' ma!'et. The on%" thin; it ,ene)its is Bit$oin $o!po!ations that $an ;o to a%% the
hass%e o) settin; that p+ settin; p thei! SSL $e!ti)i$ates and !e%"in; on $omp!omised
$e!ti)i$ate atho!ities that <e 'no< %a!;e nation states+ %i'e I!an+ o! the NSA+ has a%!ead"
$omp!omised that in)!ast!$t!e. -e have Bit$oin and <e have the ,%o$'$hain so <e se that
and thats... i) peop%e <ant to !ea%%" t!ade <ith thei! sove!ei;nt" inta$t+ <e need to se the
on%" )o!m o) dist!i,ted $onsenss that <e 'no< in te$hno%o;"+ <hi$h is the ,%o$'$hain.
Thats <hat <e have. Ho $an t"pe ni$'name the!e. =8M>KL?
AL: This is ,i%t on top o) Bit$oin and its a$ta%%" em,eddin; data into the Bit$oin
,%o$'$hain. =8M>K:?
AT: Heah+ "eah ,t its on%" 67 ,"tes eve!" )e< ho!s so its a,so%te%" minima%. -a"+ <a"
sma%%. =8N>7K?
AL: OK. Hove ;ot pee!s p he!e and I see a ,tton that sa"s 3Se!" Shop ne4t to it.
-hat happens i) <e $%i$' that ,ttonJ =8N>87?
AT: Heah+ "eah. It opens a shop )!ont. =8N>88?
AL: OK. That opens that pa!ti$%a! pe!sons shop. =8N>89?
AT: Then the!es ;oin; to ,e a des$!iption o) the p!od$t <ith pi$t!es and st)). =8N>67?
AL: &eop%e $an %eave !evie<s. A!e those !evie<s $!edited to thei! =inadi,%e?J =8N>6L?
AT: Heah+ "eah. The !evie<s a!e he!e at the ,ottom and a%so I $an %eave a !evie<. (T"pin;)
B!i%%iant ;"... K ot o) K... s,mit+ and it appea!s the!e. =8N>LK?
AL: Inte!estin;. =8N>L:?
AT: A%so+ I $an... <hi$h one <as thatJ That <as %i'e the pin'... the p!p%e... I thin' it <as
this one and I $an $%i$' 3B" ," the p!od$t. I <ant to ," "o! medi$ina% pi%%s. =8N>KL?
AL: Ho!e t"pin; into this te4t )ie%d 3I <ant to ," "o! medi$ina% pi%%s and then "o!e
s,mittin; that. Ho!e not a$ta%%" se%e$tin; an item so m$h as "o a!e sendin; that pe!son
a messa;e. =67>76?
AT: Heah+ "eah. =67>76?
AL: This is o,vios%" a p!oo) o) $on$ept. =67>79?
AT: Heah+ it <as on%" one ni;ht so <e did the simp%est thin; ,t idea%%" "od have ea$h
se%%e! <ith di))e!ent p!od$ts. Ho $%i$' the p!od$t. Ive ;ot a m%ti#si; es$!o< add!essP I
pt that in m" Bit$oin C%an. =67>8M?
AL: OK. No<+ ho< does one ;et a m%ti#si; es$!o< add!essJ Is this ;ene!atin; m%ti#si;
es$!o< add!esses )o! "oJ =67>69?
AT: Heah+ its ;ene!atin; it. =67>6K?
AL: OK. =67>6K?
AT: Then I send some ,it$oins to the!e )o! the p!od$t+ then I pt the t!ansa$tion I( in the!e+
I $%i$' 3&aid+ the se%%e! $on)i!ms that he !e$eived it and he sa"s Im shippin; the ;ood+ then
)ina%%"+ "o sa" OK+ I ;ot the ;ood and "o !e%ease the )nds ," ;ene!atin; the si;nat!e to
!e%ease the mone" to him. Then he $an !e$%aim the mone" ,t i) at an" time d!in; that
p!o$ess the!e is a dispte+ "o $an ;o to the mta% a!,ite! that "ove ,oth a;!eed pon
to;ethe!. He!e <e have identit"+ <hi$h is %i'e "o! ni$'names+ "o have... =68>76?
AL: Can an"one ,e an a!,ite! in this s"stemJ Can an" o) these pa!ti$ipants o! on%" spe$ia%
pa!ti$ipants that $an ,e a!,ite!sJ =68>7:?
AT: No+ no+ no+ an",od" $an ,e a!,ite!s ,t peop%e have to $hoose "o as an a!,ite!. Idea%%"+
a!,ite!s <o%d have !atin;s. =68>89?
AL: /st %i'e in !ea% %i)e. =68>89?
AT: Heah+ in !ea% %i)e. =68>8K?
AL: OK. =68>85?
AT: It <o%d ,e an open ma!'et so "o have identit" that "o $an %oo' p the peop%e ,"
ni$'names+ instead o) these <ei!d hashes+ <hi$h is the Ho%" C!ai% o) $!"pto. Ho have se%%e!
pa;es+ "o have !eptation and <e a%so have m%ti#si; es$!o< and a%so p!ivate messa;in;.
=68>L9?
AL: (La;hte!) Hove ,i%t this in the %ast 69 ho!sJ =68>LM?
AT: Heah+ "eah. =68>LN?
AL: Thats )n. (La;hte!) =68>98?
AT: Thats ,asi$a%%" a%% the )eat!es "o need. =68>99?
AL: Is this the !est o) the teamJ =68>99?
AT: Heah+ its desi;ne!P he made it a%% %oo' p!ett" and st))... ;ood Ao, man. Its <i$'ed.
=68>K7?
"esi+ner ,illiam -",.: Ho!e <e%$ome. Hi. =68>K6?
AT: -hats "o! nameJ =68>KL?
",: Im -i%%iam and Ive ,asi$a%%" ,een !nnin; inte!)e!en$e he%pin; these ;"s sta"
)o$sed and ope!atin;... so+ e))i$ien$". =68>KN?
AL: Coo%. =68>KN?
AT: -i%%iams a%so a Li,,it$oin $ont!i,to!. Hes ,een <o!'in; on Li, <a%%et a %ot. Main%"
the )n$tiona%it" !e%ated to the <a%%et pa!t o) Li,,it$oin+ %i'e the 'e" st)). =66>86?
AL: 1o! peop%e <ho a!ent )ami%ia! <ith Li,,it$oinP this is "o! !eimp%ementation o) the
Bit$oin spe$i)i$ation in a mod%a! ve!sion as opposed to eve!"thin; ,ein; <!apped into one
$o!e+ !i;htJ =66>66?
AT: (o "o <ant me to ;o into thatJ =66>6L?
AL: Its p!o,a,%" a %on;e! inte!vie<. I do <ant to ;et to one othe! thin; tho;h+ <hi%e Ive
;ot "o !ea% Di$'. Ho said that the pa"ment p!oto$o% is a ,ad idea to imp%ement ,e$ase it
doesnt he%p sma%% ,sinesses. =66>L9?
AT: Heah+ o) $o!se. =66>L9?
AL: -hats the ,a!!ie! to ent!" on that ,e$ase I <asnt a<a!e that the!e <as m$h o) a
,a!!ie! to ent!"J =66>LN?
AT: That "o need to ;et a%% these SSL $e!ti)i$atesP pa" )o! them. I) "o!e Ast %i'e some
'id <ith no mone"+ the <ho%e point a,ot Bit$oin is its %i'e eve!",od" $an ;et in the!e.
=66>9N?
AL: So it adds a ,a!!ie! to ent!". =66>K6?
AT: I) "o need $!edit $a!ds+ "o need to set p a O&S+ $on)i;!e "o! Apa$he+ a%% this $!ap.
No+ its not a ;ood idea i) "o!e ;oin; to t!ade on Si%' 0oad. 1o! instan$e+ I have asthma
and the othe! da"... Im in a st!an;e $ont!" and I 'no< e4a$t%" <hat I need to ;et+ I ;o to the
pha!ma$" and its %i'e )o! Q67... Oh no+ "o need to ;o to the do$to!. I ;o to the do$to! and
Im %i'e Loo'+ I Ast need a p!es$!iption. Hes %i'e No+ "o need to pa" Q8K7+ and "o
need to <ait in the <aitin; !oom )o! ha%) a da". 1$'in; he%%. -ho is that p!ote$tin;J Its
Ast pnishin; peop%eP its nonsense. Its a si;n o) ho< a%% the Aa$',oots have ,een pshed
into o! )a$e that no< <e have to as' pe!mission o! <e dont even have $ont!o% ove! <hat <e
in;est into o! o<n ,odies. T<o da"s a;o+ a Ao!na%ist )!om the Ne< Ho!' Times $ame to
visit me he!e and <e <e!e <a%'in; in the st!eet and Im te%%in; him a,ot the!e a!e so man"
ha$'e!s+ in Ha$'e!spa$es+ the" Ast ,i%d te$hno%o;" )o! themse%ves %itt%e to"s+ tin'e!in; ,t
the!e is no so$ia% motive ,ehind that. The"!e not a$ta%%" ma'in; te$hno%o;" )o! peop%e
<hi$h is <hat te$hno%o;" isP a too% )o! peop%e to se. -e <a%'ed into a ,a!+ o! <hat <e
tho;ht <as a ,a! and it happened to ,e the To!onto Ha$'e!spa$e and !i;ht the!e+ <as a%%
these to" t!ains and to" L( p!inte!s and <e <e!e %a;hin;. -e <e!e ta%'in; po%iti$a% st))
and the peop%e the!e <e!e in )avo! o) $enso!ship o) the inte!netP the ha$'e!s. The" <e!e
!ea%%" in thei! menta% ,o4es <ho <i%% p!ote$t sJ -hat a,ot the ,ad ;"sJ S$h ,%a$' and
<hite thin'in;. The!e a!e no ,ad ;"s. The!e a!e di))e!ent motives. -hen the Soviet Tnion
)e%%+ the peop%e had no idea ho< to do ,siness. The" tho;ht the" <e!e in$apa,%e o) doin;
,siness ,e$ase thei! <ho%e %ives the"d ,een to%d ho< the" sho%d ope!ate in the ma!'et.
In some sense+ <e!e not as e4t!eme as that ,t <e have %ost o! sense o) inte;!it". -h" not
to ,e <ith o! )!iendsP to net<o!' <ith the peop%e a!ond s and t!" to do the thin;s to;ethe!J
Its possi,%e and <e have the te$hno%o;" to do it and the too%s+ the indst!"+ the di))e!ent
p!oAe$ts o) e$onom" a!ond the <o!%d and this is <h" I thin' Si%' 0oad is so impo!tant
,e$ase it ;oes ,e"ond Ast a,ot the ,"in; d!;s. Its a deepe! Destion... %i'e the inte!net.
=6K>LN?
AL: -hen "o!e ta%'in; a,ot this thats the )ee%in; that I ;et )!om "o is that its not a,ot
an" pa!ti$%a! o,Ae$t+ its a,ot it not ,ein; a,ot a pa!ti$%a! o,Ae$t+ its a,ot it ,ein; open
$omme!$e and a !ea% open ma!'et <he!e the ,a!!ie! to ent!" is peop%e <antin; to do ,siness
<ith ea$h othe! and )indin; <a"s to ma'e that <o!'. These a!e ,asi$a%%" Ast too%s to $!eate
that. 0ea%%" <hat "o!e ta%'in; a,ot is Ast $!eatin; a )ai! ma!'etJ =6K>KN?
AT: Heah+ <e%% I to%d "o the sto!" a,ot asthma. A%so+ in E!ope the!e a!e %ots o) seeds
)!om %o$a% !e;ions <ith di))e!ent hea%th ,ene)its+ man" doGens o) them ,t ,e$ase o) some
,!ea$!ats+ <ho Ast sa" Oh+ these a!e the ones that a!e a%%o<ed and eve!"thin; o)) that %ist
is i%%e;a%. A%% the %o$a% !e$ipes o! %o$a% nat!a% medi$ines... =65>L8?
AL: Lo$a%. The"!e %o$a%. =65>L8?
AT: Heah+ the"!e Ast ,anned and the" $ant ,e so%d on the inte!net ,t <ith Bit$oin the"
$an. I have a )!iend <ho ;oes to the )!it ma!'ets a)te! the"ve $%osed and "o 'no< the!es
%i'e the app%es <ith a dent in it+ o! the tomato thats ;one a ,it so)tP the!es nothin; <!on;
<ith it. Its Ast the" $ant se%% it so the" $h$' it ot. He ta'es that and he ma'es ma!ma%ade
<ith it and he se%%s $heap ma!ma%ade ,t ,e$ase o) the ET !e;%ations+ hea%th and sa)et"+
,%ah+ ,%ah+ ,%ah+ he $ant se%% it on the inte!net. -ith Bit$oin+ "o $an. This is ;!eat se o)
othe!<ise <asted )ood. -h" notJ =6:>7M?
AL: Let me p%a" devi%s advo$ate he!e. -hat i) some,od"... <hat i) he se%%s that on the
inte!net )o! Bit$oin to someone <ho is in the same $ont!"+ o! in a di))e!ent $ont!" and that
pe!son ;ets si$' and dies ,e$ase thats somethin; <ith $anned ;oods+ the $onseDen$es a!e
p!ett" se!ios i) "o ;et it <!on;. =6:>66?
AT: A%% o) %ast "ea!+ I had no mone" and I spent... the <a" I ate <as ;oin; to spe!ma!'ets
and s'ippin; thei! ,ins. The" th!o< ot a %ot o) ;ood )ood in the pa$'a;in; ,e$ase its a da"
past se%% ," and its pe!)e$t%" edi,%e. The!es a h;e amont o) <aste in o! so$iet"...
AL: Im not a!;in; a,ot that. =6:>96?
AT: ...and this <aste is not d!iven ," the ma!'et+ its d!iven ," $onsme!ism+ ," ,o!!o<in;+
," ;!o<th and ove!$onsmption. Its not a,ot ma'in; the thin;s "o have ;o )!the!. Its
a,ot ,o!!o<in; on de,t+ a,ot %ivin; otside o) "o! means and thats not the <o!%d that I
<ant to %ive in. The <ho%e p%anet is ,ein; dest!o"ed. -hen I <as %ivin; in Ca%i)o!nia+ I sta!t
to dis$ove! a,ot the nat!e a!ond me and its a,so%te%" dep!essin; ho< the e$os"stem is
,ein; dest!o"ed and <e!e dest!o"in; a%% o) o! )ood sto$'s+ !ep%a$in; a%% the dive!sit" <hi$h
he%ps s to %ive+ to ,e hea%th"+ <ith pests and pa!asites. This is the %e;a$" <e!e %eavin; to
o! $hi%d!en <ho a!e ;oin; to pa". Its not s <ho have to pa". -e Ast ,!n the oi% and its
;oin; to !n ot and thats that. =6M>95?
AL: Ami! Taa'i+ I !ea%%" %oo' )o!<a!d to hea!in; mo!e )!om "o ove! the ne4t $op%e o)
da"s. I thin' this is not ;oin; to ,e o! on%" inte!vie<. Than' "o ve!" m$h )o! "o! time
and ;ood <o!' on this p!oAe$t. =6M>K5?
AT: Cood to meet "o. =6M>K5?
AL: Heah a,so%te%". Its ;ood to )ina%%" meet "o too. =6M>KM?
AT: Thats <i$'ed. =6M>KN?
@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@
Adam B. Levine interview with &on "em/o
&": Hi+ Im 0on (em,o+ )onde! and CEO o) 2e!o)ootp!int. &!io! to that I <as the )onde!
and CEO o) A%;o!ithmi$s (JJ Inadi,%e) $ompan" and p!io! to that (JJ Inadi,%e). =6N>65?
AL: Te%% me a,ot 2e!o)ootp!int. -hat is it that "o do at 2e!o)ootp!intJ =6N>L7?
&": At 2e!o)ootp!int+ <e have a mission to ma'e %a!;e s$a%e ,ehavio! $han;e )easi,%e+ so in
pa!ti$%a!+ <e ,e;an <ith p!e envi!onmenta% issesP thin;s %i'e !ed$tion in $a!,on on a
%a!;e s$a%e ,t+ mo!e !e$ent%"+ <eve moved to mo!e o) <hat <o%d ,e $a%%ed a sstaina,i%it"
a;enda+ o! <hat <e $a%% it a ;ood a;enda. That is+ hea%th is a ve!" ,i; pa!t o) it as <e%% as
envi!onment. Thats ,ased on simp%" the )a$t that hea%th and ene!;" and <ate! and )ood a!e
a%% inte!%in'ed. Ho $ant !ea%%" i;no!e one and %eave the othe! and thin' "ove !ea%%" done
ho%isti$ $han;e. =L7>8K?
AL: -hen it $omes to ho%isti$ $han;e+ "o!e sa"in; that 2e!o)ootp!int ena,%es %a!;e se!s
to do thisJ -hat does it do that ena,%es %a!;e se!s to do this <he!e the" $o%dnt on thei!
o<nJ =L7>65?
&": -hat <e do is <e %in' se!s <ho do a ;ood a$tion+ %ets sa" the a$tion is <a%'in; L7
mins a da" so that "o ;et hea%thie!+ <ith peop%e <ho a!e inte!ested in )ndin; that event and
<ith p!od$ts that a!e ;ood )o! them. Essentia%%"+ <e t!a$' a %i)e $"$%e o) ;ood. An e4amp%e
mi;ht ,e a %i)e ins!an$e $ompan" that <o%d %i'e to 'no< that "o a!e a$ta%%" e4e!$isin; L7
mins a da" ,e$ase thei! $osts <i%% ;o do<n i) the"!e ins!in; "o+ so the" motivate "o to
do this ," ;ivin; "o Cood$oins )o! <a%'in; L7 mins a da". -hats !ea%%" $han;ed !e$ent%"
and <h" <e!e a$ta%%" in ,siness+ is the )a$t that "o $an meas!e this. In othe! <o!ds+ "o
$an do this on an eviden$e#,ased ,asis. I) I t!a$' "o! Ni'e ,and+ o! "o! Moves app and it
te%%s me ho< m$h "ove moved+ ,ased on that+ I $an a$ta%%" !e<a!d "o and then I $an
%in' "o to othe! p!od$ts and se!vi$es that a!e ;ood+ pa!ti$%a!%" )o! "o. -e do this th!o;h
a me$hanism $a%%ed Bit$oin and ,it$oins !ea%%" a!e a $!!en$" its a pa!a%%e% $!!en$" that
<o!'s ve!" <e%% in a ,a!te!in; sitation. Ho <a%' L7 mins a da" and "o $an t!ans%ate that
into ,"in; ;ood )ood+ o! a !ed$tion on ;ood )ood. Ho save ene!;" and "o $an ;et
,it$oins and se those to ," devi$es that <i%% imp!ove "o! hea%th. The %i)e $"$%e o) a
,it$oin is $ont!o%%ed+ as opposed to sa" the %i)e $"$%e o) an" ai! mi%e p!o;!am. =L6>67?
AL: Lets ta%' a,ot that )o! a se$ond. It sonds to me %i'e <hat "o!e doin; is "o!e
Danti)"in;. Ho ta%'ed a,ot the ,!a$e%ets and thin;s %i'e that. Those a!e devi$es that have
motion senso!s in them+ and thin;s %i'e that+ that then a!e a,%e to Danti)"... thats !ea%%" <hat
"o!e ta%'in; a,ot he!e at 2e!o)ootp!int+ I thin'+ is Danti)"in; these events that "o have
$%assi)ied as ;ood+ !i;htJ =L6>97?
&": In a sense+ one o) the thin;s that <e!e doin; thats !ea%%" ne< is <e!e doin; eve!"thin;
on an eviden$e#,ased ,asis. =L6>9:?
AL: -hen "o ta%' a,ot an eviden$e#,ased ,asis+ this is $ompa!ed to somethin; <he!e
someone $ommits to doin; somethin;+ the" sa" I <i%% do this and then "o sa" OK+ <e%%
<e%% pa" "o in advan$e )o! that+ !athe! "o!e sa"in; (o the <o!' )i!st and se these
va!ios <a"s to p!ove that "ove done the <o!' and then "o%% ,e $ompensated )o! the
<o!' that "ove a$ta%%" done. =LL>75?
&": Heah+ so )o! e4amp%e+ i) "o thin' o) man" ;ove!nmenta% p!o;!ams+ <hat "o t"pi$a%%"
have is the ;ove!nment $omes ot <ith a p!o;!am to ;et "o to eat <e%%+ o! <a%'+ o! <hateve!
and those p!o;!ams a!e )nded p )!ont !athe! than on the ,a$' end. I) "o <a%'+ I%% pa" "o
,t not othe!<ise. -hats happened is the!e is a p!o%i)e!ation o) devi$es ot the!e no< and
its ;!o<in; e4ponentia%%". Thin' o) Coo;%es $onta$t %ens that <i%% meas!e "o! ;%$ose
%eve%s. I) "o a!e a dia,eti$ and "o 'eep "o! ;%$ose %eve%s <ithin $e!tain !an;es d!in; the
da"+ as meas!ed ," "o! $onta$t %ens+ <e <i%% !e<a!d "o <e+ ,ein; the pe!son <ho
,ene)its )!om that. It $o%d ,e the (epa!tment o) Hea%th+ it $o%d ,e an ins!an$e $ompan"+
and it $o%d ,e "o! ,siness+ "o! o))i$e. =LL>KN?
AL: Is that in)o!mation t!anspa!entJ In this pa!ti$%a! e4amp%e that "o!e ;ivin; me+ do
"o thin' that Coo;%e <o%d ,e a,%e to a$ta%%" see m" ;%$ose %eve%s+ o! <o%d the" Ast ,e
a,%e to see that the" <e!e <ithin this !an;eJ A!e "o+ as the $ompan"+ doin; the Danti)"in;+
doin; an" so!t o) )i%te!in; %i'e this+ o! p!ovidin; an" so!t o) ,))e!+ o! is it Ast t!anspa!en$"
th!o;h. =L9>68?
&": The!e <o%d ,e ,))e!s )o! eve!" devi$e. 1o! e4amp%e+ <e se a devi$e no< thats on
"o! i&hone. Its a Q6 app that a%%o<s "o meas!e <hethe! "o <a%'+ ,i'e o! !n toda" and
ho< m$h "o did and that devi$e o,vios%" is mode% ,ased in thei! e!!o!s. The!e is no
mode% that is 877U $o!!e$t+ its !ea%%"... a ,i; sa"in; in statisti$s is 3A%% mode%s a!e <!on; ,t
some a!e se)%. This mode%+ to some de;!ee+ ;ives "o a )ai!%" ;ood !eadin; on ho< man"
steps "o too' toda". Based on that nm,e! o) steps+ <e $an so!t o) $a%i,!ate that mode% to
sa" a Ni'e ,and+ <hi$h a%so meas!es steps. It p!o,a,%" $omes p <ith a di))e!ent nm,e!
and ,ased on those nm,e!s "o $an thin' o) it as an inde4+ <e $an a$ta%%" dete!mine ho<
m$h "o <a%' and !e<a!d "o )o! <a%'in; eno;h. =LK>8L?
AL: OK+ $oo%. -hen it $omes to the !e<a!ds on these+ I hea!d "o ta%'in; a,ot e4amp%es
that have peop%e <ho a!e 'ind o) a%!ead" invested in me+ !i;htJ M" ins!an$e $ompan"
<o%d $a!e that I am ta'in; steps to not need to se m" ins!an$e. That seems %i'e somethin;
the" <o%d $%ea!%" <ant to in$entiviGe. 0ea%%"+ it seems %i'e <hat "o!e doin; he!e is "o!e
p!ovidin; a midd%e %a"e! <he!e $ompanies+ that "o have a !e%ationship <ith a%!ead"+ <ant
"o to do st)) ,ased on that !e%ationship that <i%% ma'e thei! !e%ationship <ith "o ,ette!.
Ho+ essentia%%"+ p!ovide the in$entive %a"e! <he!e "o!e a,%e to meas!e those thin;s that
those $ompanies <o%d %i'e "o to do and then to a%so $ompensate )o! doin; those thin;s.
Ho!e p!ovidin; an in$entive %a"e! he!e+ !i;htJ Thats <hat this p!o;!am !ea%%" is. =LK>KM?
&": Be"ond that to the ins!e!+ o,vios%" s,Ae$t to p!iva$"+ <hat <e dete!mine at some
%eve% a!e <ho a!e the peop%e <ho a!e most ss$epti,%e to a pa!ti$%a! t"pe o) !e<a!d+ <hi$h is
ve!" se)% in)o!mation )o! sa"+ I dont 'no<+ -ho%e)oods and mi;ht <ant to se%% o!;ani$
)ood. =L5>8:?
AL: OK. =L5>8M?
&": I) Im someone <ho is ve!" di%i;ent a,ot <a%'in; eve!" da"+ Im mo!e %i'e%"+ and I
$a!e a,ot the <o!%d+ Im mo!e %i'e%" to <ant to ," o!;ani$ )ood than i) I <as Ast an
ave!a;e pe!son in the pop%ation. =L5>L7?
AL: The!es a%so a <o!'in; e%ement to it too. =L5>LL?
&": -e do identi)" <hateve! ;ood is+ so in the e4amp%e o) some o) the thin;s that <e!e
invo%ved in no<+ <e have th!ee $ities+ t<o o) <hi$h I $an ta%' a,ot ,t one o) <hi$h+ in that
$it"+ <e!e %oo'in; at !ed$tions in e%e$t!i$it"+ ;as and <ate! and <a%'in;+ sim%taneos%".
Ho $an ima;ine that i) I )ond a pe!son <ho <as ve!" di%i;ent a,ot !ed$in; thei! ene!;"
and <a%' eve!" da" no<+ the"!e mo!e %i'e%" to ,e someone <ho <o%d ,e inte!ested in doin;
;ood )o! the <o!%d. Some o) these se%%in; p!od$ts that a!e ;ood )o! the <o!%d <o%d mo!e
%i'e%" ,e a,%e to se%% to those peop%e. -e p!ovide that ni$he ma!'et. -e 'no< <ho is
inte!ested in ;ood and hen$e the name Cood$oins. =L:>6N?
AL: Lets ta%' a,ot Cood$oins )o! a se$ond. These a!e a to'en and ;ene!a%%"+ <hen <e ta%'
a,ot to'ens on the Lets Ta%' Bit$oin sho<+ <e!e ta%'in; a,ot )%% on $!"pto$!!en$" that
"o $an then ta'e and t!ade )o! an" othe! $!"pto$!!en$". 1!om the $onve!sation that "o and
I had ea!%ie!+ it doesnt sond %i'e thats the $ase <ith this one. Can "o 'ind o) ta%' a,ot
<hat this $oin isJ Ho< its di))e!ent )!om othe!sJ -hat t"pe o) ti%it" "o thin' it hasJ
=L:>K6?
&": The!e a!e t<o aspe$ts that a!e di))e!ent. One is the $o%%ate!a% that "o <ant )o! the $oin
is some so$ia% ;ood that has o$$!!ed... "o <a%'ed on this da"+ "o !ed$ed ene!;"+ and so
on. That+ in some sense+ ,a$'s the $oin. The othe! di))e!en$e is that the $oin is not )n;i,%e
into othe! $!!en$ies+ e4$ept othe! $!!en$ies that do ;ood+ )o! e4amp%e+ it mi;ht ,e )n;i,%e
into a nit o) some $ha!it"+ o! it mi;ht ,e )n;i,%e into somethin; thats inhe!ent%" ;ood %i'e a
devi$e to he%p "o <ith "o! hea%th. Ho $an thin' o) it mo!e %i'e a ,a!te! $!!en$". Ho!e
,a!te!in; one )o!m o) ;ood )o! anothe!. Its not a $!!en$" that "o $o%d ima;ine that one
<o%d spe$%ate <ith. Ima;ine i) the <o!st $omes to the <o!st and someone stea%s m"
Cood$oins+ <e%% a%% the" $an do <ith them is ," ;ood st))+ so its not ;oin; to ,e dama;in;
in the <o!st $ase. =LM>K:?
AL: -h" <o%d some,od" <ant to have Cood$oins i) the"!e not e4$han;ea,%e )o! othe!
thin;s+ ,e$ase one $an ma'e an a!;ment that sto$' isnt e4$han;ea,%e )o! othe! thin;s and
"et sto$' has va%e and "et sto$' $an app!e$iate. -hat ;ives Cood$oins va%eJ =LN>8L?
&": The" a!e e4$han;ea,%e )o! p!od$ts that a!e ;ood+ )o! e4amp%e+ I $an ," an o!;ani$
$hi$'en <ith 6+777 ,it$oins ,e$ase <e ,ein; in a so$iet" <e!e in mi;ht deem that o!;ani$
$hi$'ens a!e ;ood )o! "o. =LN>6M?
AL: -ho sets those p!i$es i) the ma!'et isnt a%%o<ed to do that and <ho <o%d se%% "o the
$hi$'enJ -h" <o%d someone se%% "o a $hi$'en )o! somethin; that $ant ,e then sed )o!
somethin; e%seJ =LN>97?
&": Ima;ine -ho%e)oods <ants to se%% mo!e $hi$'ens and the" <ant to d!ive "o to thei!
sto!e. Im Ast sin; them as an e4amp%eP <e dont have a dea% <ith -ho%e)oods. The"
a$ta%%" $ome and pt an ad on "o! site+ e))e$tive%" I thin' it <o%d %oo' %i'e a $opon and
that $opon <o%d ;ive "o some ;ood !eason to ;o into thei! sto!e+ %i'e this month on%"
"od ;et 87U !ed$tion on $hi$'en <ith 6+777 ,it$oins. The Cood$oins+ in this $ase+ a!e
ma!'etin; $!!en$" )o! -ho%e)oods ,t the" a!e "o! ,a!te!in; $!!en$" as an o<ne! o) a
Cood$oin <a%%et. In that $ase+ its a p!e ma!'etin; e))o!t on the pa!t o) -ho%e)oods ,t
,e$ase <eve deemed+ o! so$iet" has deemed that the o!;ani$ $hi$'en the" se%% is ;ood )o!
"o+ o! the %o$a% )ood the" se%% is ;ood )o! the %o$a% e$onom"+ that ,a!te!in; is a%%o<ed.
E))e$tive%" the $oins do have va%e and+ in this $ase+ the" t!ans%ate the -ho%e)oods into
ma!'etin; va%e. In the $ase o) othe! devi$es+ the pe!son se%%in; that devi$e ;ets to ,e
inte!ested in mo!e than one thin; that the" se%%+ so its d!ivin; "o to thei! sto!e. Thats <he!e
the va%e $omes to ,e. =97>KL?
AL: Its %i'e a !e,ate s"stem )o! the enti!e e$os"stem o) ;ood as opposed to ,ein; $ente!ed
on one pa!ti$%a! thin;. -hen peop%e a!e ta%'in; a,ot to'ens a;ain+ in a $!"pto$!!en$"
pa!adi;m+ <hen -ho%e)oods !e$eived a Cood$oin+ the" <o%d then ,e a,%e to se%% that ,a$'
onto the ma!'et. -hat happens to Cood$oins <hen the" a!e spentJ =98>89?
&": The" a!e !eti!ed o!+ in some $ases ,a!te!ed )o! othe! ;ood. I) -ho%e)oods <ants to
!e<a!d its emp%o"ees <ith Cood$oins <hi$h the" $o%d then spend on a ;%$ose mete!+ the"
$an do that. In othe! <o!ds+ %ets sa" "o!e Ai!,n, ;ives "o Cood$oins )o! eve!" Ai!,n,
,oo'in;+ its p!o,a,%e that Cood$oins ;o th!o;h a %i)e $"$%e o) ,a!te!in; ,t in ea$h $ase+ the
,a!te!in; is )o! ;ood. =98>9M?
AL: 0on (em,o+ than's )o! sha!in; "o! p!oAe$t <ith s. To %ea!n mo!e+ visit thei! <e,site
at <<<.Cood$oins.$a. =98>K:?
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A"%E&T:
He" )o%'s+ Adam B. Levin he!e <ith some pdates. 1i!st%"+ <<<.Bit$oin&a$'a;in;.$om is
%an$hed and is !ead" )o! o!de!s. Ho mi;ht not thin' that "o need a s%eeve o) 877
,iop%asti$ d!in' $ps ,t as Bit$oin ,e$omes mo!e mainst!eam+ mo!e o) the ,sinesses "o
eat at <i%% have a need )o! this so!t o) thin;. -hen the" as' <hat the" $an do <ith the ,it$oin
peop%e pa" to them+ no< "o $an te%% them that a%% thei! )ood se!vi$e pa$'a;in; is avai%a,%e
)o! ,e%o< thei! $!!ent $ost <hen the" spend it <ith <<<.Bit$oin&a$'a;in;.$om. =96>L9?
A''()'*EME'T:
This is one o) o! man" attempts to he%p $%ose the %oop. In othe! ne<s+ the!e a!e t<o side to
eve!" sto!" and Mi'e Hea!n+ <ho <as mentioned at %en;th d!in; Episode 875 <ith Ami!
Taa'i+ ve!" m$h disa;!ees <ith some o) the thin;s said. Nota,%"+ that he $o%%a,o!ated <ith
(t$h po%i$e+ hes <o!'in; <ith Ci!$%e (hes on the adviso!" ,oa!d ,t isnt an emp%o"ee) and
a%so too' isse <ith ho< Ami! des$!i,ed ,ein; !emoved )!om the Bit$oin se$!it" %ist. To
!ead his )%% $omments+ visit <<<.%etsta%',it$oin.$omB$onte!point. =9L>76?
Ba$' to the sho<I =9L>79?
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0tephanie M!rph# interview with Ernest 1ancoc
0M: Im he!e ta%'in; <ith E!nest Han$o$'. E!nest is an o%d )!iend o) mine and he is a !adio
sho< host and a 1!eedom a$tivist. He !ns the pop%a! 1!eedom <e,site+
<<<.)!eedomsphoeni4.$om. That <as a %ot o) 1!eedom. =9L>8N?
E1: 1!eeeeedomI -ith an 3S <<<.)!eedomsphoeni4.$om. 1o!tnate%"+ m" ,!othe!#in#%a<
%ives he!e and hes a ,ond !aide! at Mood"s+ so "o $an ima;ine the inte!estin;
$onve!sations <e have. =9L>L6?
0M: Oe!" inte!estin;. =9L>LL?
E1: I ;ot him to $ommit to $omin; to an ho! tomo!!o<+ so I <as hopin; to ;et the ,est....
the ,est thin; is+ is that <e ;et MaidSa)e+ <<<.MaidSa)e.net. MaidSa)e is a dist!i,ted+ o))#
the#;!id+ tota%%" en$!"pted+ eve!"thin;+ 'ind o) pee! to pee! inte!net and I too' thei! -hite
pape!s and sent them... <eve ;ot eno;h ,e!;ee's in the %i,e!ta!ian movement and I said
Ta'e a %oo' at this. Is this <hat I thin' it isJ.... and the"!e HepI It <as <hat <e tho;ht+ as
"on; a$tivists ,a$' <hen <e <e!e a %ot o) these !evo%tiona!ies a;e t<ent" )ive "ea!s a;o+
that the inte!net <o%d ;o to a... "o <o%d have a%% the in)o!mation on ,%%etin ,oa!ds+ o! on
"o! o<n se!ve!s+ o! dist!i,ted amon;st peop%es $ompte!s and empt" spa$e on ha!d d!ives.
-e <o%d ,e the inte!net+ not this inte!net se!vi$e p!ovide! that <o%d have the NSA a!ms
and %e;s <!apped a!ond thei! data %ines. -e tho;ht that <as <he!e the inte!net <as ;oin;
to ;o. -hen it <ent to the -o!%d -ide -e, and a%% this $ent!a%iGed mind#set+ it 'ind o) <ent
do<n the da!'side ,t the!e <e!e a %ot o) peop%e+ %i'e (avid I!vine+ that sa< this as a se!ve!
;" ,a$' in the 3N7s and the" sta!ted $!eatin; thei! o<n st)) )o! the %ast seven o! ei;ht "ea!s.
-hat <e did is <e said (o "o 'no< <hatJ -hat <e!e ;o ahead and do is <e!e ;oin; to
;o ahead and $!eate this t"pe o) dist!i,ted inte!net thats en$!"pted and eve!"thin;s
a$$essi,%e to an",od"+ en$!"pted+ and I $o%d see that this <as a mani)estation o) <hat <e
<e!e thin'in; a,ot t<ent" )ive "ea!s a;o. -hen I had the ,e!;ee's and the Li,e!t"
movement %oo' at it+ i) this is <hat I tho;ht it <as (and the" sta!ted ;ettin; e4$ited peop%e
I !espe$ted)+ so I ;o HepI Im ,oo'in; m" t!ip to Ne< Ho!'+ so he!e I am. I ;ot to meet
them and the" <e!e sittin; the!e ta%'in; in the )o!ms+ so the" int!od$ed me to the !epo!te!
)!om 1o!,es and the" e4p%ained <h" I <as so e4$ited a,ot them. I ;o to the 1o!,es and Im
%i'e Ho ;"s have no idea <hat... "o dont nde!stand... as m$h as the" didnt
nde!stand Bit$oin+ the" dont nde!stand this ne< te$hno%o;". I am o) the opinion that i)
this pans ot <hat the"!e doin;+ and the"!e spea'in; tomo!!o< the" ;ot added to the
p!o;!am+ the!e is so m$h inte!est in them+ the" <e!e %i'e OK. Im ,!in;in; m" ,!othe!#in#
%a< and <e!e ;oin; to ;et a Mood"s ;" in he!e. Hes ;oin; to ,e the sma!test ;" at the
<ate! $oo%e! and its ;oin; to ,e a p!esentation o) <hat I thin' is the )t!e o) the inte!net.
-e%% see i) E!nies !i;ht... a;ainI =95>7L?
0M: Heah+ E!nies ,een !i;ht ,e)o!e. (La;hte!) =95>75?
E1: Its ;oin; to ,e )n. I %oo' )o!<a!d to p!omotin;... Ive had them on t<i$e. I) "o Ast
do a Coo;%e sea!$h on (avid I!vine+ E!nest Han$o$' o! MaidSa)e.net and 1!eedoms&hoeni4+
the t<o sho<s <e did <i%% $ome p. One <as int!od$tion and the othe! one <as a)te! I had
some o) o! ;"s ta'e a %oo' at the te$hni$a% -hite pape!s )i!st and some va%idation o) <hats
$omin;. &eop%e sho%d pa" attention to that. I thin' thats ;oin; to ,e a<esomeI =95>L9?
0M: Ho!e !ea%%" e4$ited a,ot MaidSa)e. -hat do "o <ant it )o!J -h" do <e need a
de$ent!a%iGed inte!netJ =95>98?
E1: -hat it o))e!s is the a,i%it" at the !oot to ,e en$!"pted )o! eve!" 8 and 7 that ;oes ove!
an" $ommni$ation that <e do. Thats not Ast thin;s %i'e Bit$oin+ its not Ast thin;s %i'e
,ein; a,%e to do<n%oad and pi!ate and do... and eve!"thin;. Its a%% 8s and 7s that no,od"
;ets to see and "o $an do <hateve! "o <ant. The thin; is+ is that the" t!" to $o$h it as
Heah+ ,t "od ,e %i'e ,"in; d!;s and ;ettin; hoo'e!s+ o! somethin; (not that the!es a
p!o,%em <ith that). (La;hte!) =9:>8L?
0M: No,od" does that <ith $ash. =9:>85?
E1: Heah. See+ thats m" point. The <ho%e thin; is+ is that its not a,ot <hat "o do <ith
"o! )!eedom+ its a,ot havin; "o! )!eedom. 1o! me is that+ I dont $a!e <hat "o do <ith
"o! )!eedom+ I Ast <ant to ,e )!ee. Its a,ot me+ not "o. Its %i'e p!itans a%% ove! the
p%anet <o!!"in; a,ot some,od" havin; )n some<he!e. The thin; is+ is that <hat it !ea%%" is
and the po<e! ,ehind it )o! me+ is that <hen <e <e!e at Te4as Bit$oin $on)e!en$e it <as the
same isse. The!e is not a me$hanism ," <hi$h I $an donate to %i,e!t" $ases anon"mos%".
Not even <ith Bit$oin. Im ;oin; That is <he!e the po<e! is+ that "o $an donate n%imited
amonts o) mone" to "o!se%) and ;o ove! a ,o!de! to someone e%se )o! some p!oAe$t that "o
sppo!t+ and not have an" 'ind o) !epe!$ssions )!om the 3Man. On$e that happens+ the
;ove!nment Ast ,e$omes ana$h!onisti$ and its ove!. I thin' its <ithin... "o 'no<+ !ea%%"
$%ose on the ho!iGon. I see the sto!m $%ods and I thin' the 3Man does too. =9M>8L?
0M: Ho thin' thats ;oin; to happenJ The ;ove!nments ;oin; to ,e$ome+ ,asi$a%%"+
o,so%ete as these te$hno%o;ies $ome otJ The!es not ;oin; to ,e a vio%ent !evo%tion... its a
pea$e)% evo%tionJ =9M>68?
E1: No+ <e%% it <i%% ,e vio%ent to them. The"%% ma'e it vio%ent and I mean+ the"%% ,e ;oin;
a!ond. It is vio%ent and the"!e ;oin; to have Bi%%" $%,s ,eatin; the $!ap ot o) an",od"
that doesnt %i$' thei! ,oots )ast eno;h. =9M>6N?
0M: Cood point+ "eah. =9M>L7?
E1: The vio%en$e is a%!ead" the!e ,t its not so;ht ," s. The" need the vio%en$e to Asti)"
thei! e4isten$e. -hat happened <as is Im %i'e I see that the!e is the a,i%it" )o! s+ "o and
I+ and an",od"+ )o! s to $ommni$ate in an" <a" <ith )inan$ia% t!ansa$tions+
$ommni$ation+ ,is$it !e$ipes+ <hateve! that the 3Man doesnt have an" 'ind o) a,i%it" to
stop it+ to !e;%ate it o! to so$ia%%" o! e$onomi$a%%" en;inee! <hi$h one <e do o! ho< <e do
it. On$e that happens+ the ;ove!nment ,e$omes ana$h!onisti$. Let me ;ive "o an e4amp%e
a "ea! and a ha%) a;o+ a)te! I sa< <hat Bit$oin !ep!esented+ m" <i)e (onna and I+ <e
,o;ht+ at an a$tion+ some %and in No!the!n A!iGona. -e too' that %and and <e said Ho
'no< <hatJ -e!e not ;oin; to !e;iste! it <ith the Cont" 0e$o!de!. -hat <e!e ;oin; to do
is <e!e Ast ;oin; to 'eep it+ t!ans)e! it )!om... have him ta'e possession in a T!st+ then se%%
it to a T!st that <e did and then not )i%e it+ <aitin; )o! BitLand+ Bit&a!$e%+ BitSomethin; and
<e !e;iste! it <ith that. No<+ <e%% pa" the ta4es. I dont <ant to dea% <ith that isse ,t
<hat I <ant to do is not !e;iste! it <ith the ;ove!nment+ I !e;iste! it <ith the p%anet o) a
,%o$'$hain that <e !e$o;niGe HepI Thats the C&S $oo!dinates o) "o! <hateve!... =9N>9M?
0M: 0i;ht. =9N>9N?
E1: ...<ho <i%% en)o!$e it+ <ho <i%% !e$o;niGe it. I dont $a!e. 1i!st "ove ;ot to ,e a,%e to
do it. -hen "o do it+ <hat does that meanJ Ho dont need a Cont" 0e$o!de! an"mo!e
,e$ase Im ;oin; Ho< do "o !e$o;niGe a p!ope!t" !i;htJ 1i!st+ "ove ;ot to de)ine it+
then <hos ;oin; to en)o!$e itJ -e%%+ the ;ove!nment doesnt en)o!$e it. The" Ast side <ith
the ,an's no matte! <hat and )o!e$%os!e o) <hateve! and <ho pa"s them eno;h. Im Ast
;oin; The" a%!ead" %ost thei! $!edi,i%it"+ so no< Im %oo'in; )o! anothe! <a" to
demonst!ate ho< this $an e%iminate the Cont" 0e$o!de! ,e$ase that <as a !oad,%o$' in m"
o<n mind. On$e I sa< that this $o%d ,e done+ a%% o) a sdden Im ;oin; A<<< ,a,"I Its
a%% ove!. Ho Ast sta!t $hippin; a<a" at a%% the thin;s that ;ove!nment sa" that the" have in
m" se!vi$e. -e%%+ the" dont. This <as Ast anothe! e4amp%e. MaidSa)e a%%o<s that on %i'e
eve!"thin;. An" 8s and 7s on $ommni$ation ove! Ote!net+ <hi$h is the $,e sats. The"
Ast %an$hed in 1e,!a!"+ thi!t" th!ee sma%% sate%%ites and ,oomI The"!e done. =K7>K8?
0M: AmaGin;I The )t!e is he!e. =K7>KL?
E1: (oneI (oneI (oneI =K7>KK?
0M: (La;hte!) Ho!e a%so !ea%%" e4$ited a,ot BitSha!es+ !i;htJ =K7>K:?
E1: -hat happened <as /o," -ee's and Stephanie a!e ;ood )!iends and the" did thei! neon
ene!;" d!in'. The" sponso!ed an event !i;ht ," -a%% St!eet. The!e the" have )i)t" )eet )!om
the openin; to -a%% St!eet... the ,i%din; the!e+ <he!e the" have peop%e $ome in <ith
sit$ases o) $ash and the"!e ,"in; Bit$oin and se%%in;+ and ,a$' and )o!th. The"!e doin;
and ,"in; sha!es in $ompanies. I ta%'ed to the ;"s in BitSha!es he!e and <anted to have
them $ome on the sho< and eve!"thin; and e4p%ain to me ho< m$h mo!e... its not se$!it"+
its Ast mo!e honest in havin; the a,i%it" o) a t!anspa!ent o<ne!ship o) $ompanies. Its Ast
anothe!... ma'in; ;ove!nment ana$h!onisti$. I dont need to have them !e;%ate it. The"
$ant !e;%ate. Its tota%%" otside o) that and <ho !ep!esents the $!edi,i%it" and the va%idit" o)
m" o<ne!ship in some $ompan" sin; BitSha!esJ -e%%+ the" do. I) the" dont do it+ then I
dont <ant to have an"thin; to do <ith them an"mo!e. Its ;oin; past -a%% St!eet. I %ove it
that the" did it !i;ht ne4t to it ,e$ase Im ;oin; I $an do this and o<n a pie$e o) a
$ompan" <ithot havin; to )i%e an I0S thin;. I dont have to sho< m" $apita% ;ains o) ho<
m$h I o<n and pt it on the sto$' p!$hase+ so i) Im !nnin; )o! o))i$e and Ive ;ot a
de$%a!e this $%aim+ <hateve!. =K6>85?
0M: -ithot ,ein; an a$$!edited investo! too ,e$ase !i;ht no<+ sma%% investo!s $ant !ea%%"
," sha!es in $ompanies. =K6>66?
E1: It ,"passes a%% so$ia% and e$onomi$ en;inee!in; <hen the" sa" -e%%+ its to p!ote$t
"o. Ho sho%d have %imits on this o! "o $an on%" do so m$h o) that. =K6>LL?
0M: 0i;ht. Its )o! "o! o<n ;ood. =K6>LK?
E1: I dont <ant them to even have that. I) I s$!e< p+ ;ess <hatJ I ;et edma$ated p!ett"
damn Di$' <hen I %ose m" mone". =K6>98?
0M: 0i;ht. =K6>96?
E1: Thats the ,est !e;%ato!+ is the )!ee ma!'et. -hen I ta%' to peop%e that a!e so m$h in
the s"stem and the"!e so $on$e!ned a,ot -e%%+ some,od"s ;oin; to ;et s$!e<ed. I ;o
CoodI That <o%d ,e a %esson %ea!ned <ont itJ =K6>KL?
0M: 0i;ht. =K6>K9?
E1: Thats <he!e the !e;%ation is+ is )!om the %ea!nin;. The!e a!e ;oin; to ,e so%tions ot
the!e. -eve ;ot to ;et the nann" state ot o) o! hai!+ so that a%% these thin;s <i%% ,%ossom
and Im seein; it happen. The" had an event he!e <he!e the" had a ,n$h o) p!o#!e;%ato!s
and this ;" <as an aid to Ch$' S$hme!+ this ;" <as an atto!ne" )o! ;ove!nment+ o!
<hateve! and someone <ho <as a %o,,"ist )o! the Canadian ;ove!nment. The"!e a%% -e%%+
"ove ;ot to have... so that its app!oved ," ;ove!nment. Im ;oin; -h"J One+ "o dont
nde!stand that <hat "o!e advo$atin;+ "o $ant !e;%ate the ,%o$'$hain. Thats the point.
Ho!e ta%'in; a,ot the thi!d pa!t" peop%e ,t the" dont eve! ma'e that point. Im ;oin;
-hat "o!e advo$atin; )o! is a di))e!ent $!"pto$!!en$" that $an ,e !e;%ated. 1ine+ 'no$'
"o!se%) ot ,t the" dont advo$ate that ,e$ase the" 'no< no,od" <i%% do it. The" <ont
se it. The"!e t!"in; to someho< ;et some 'ind o) tenta$%es o! Ast o! ,!ain a!ond the idea
o) vo%nta!i%" a%%o<in; )o! !e;%ation in Bit$oin. The a!;ment is -e%%+ "o%% ,e t!adin;
Bit$oin at Sta!,$'s. I ;o CoodI I tho;ht that <as <hat it <as ;oin; to ,e an"<a".
=K9>7K?
0M: 0i;ht. =K9>75?
E1: I dont nde!stand "o! point. Late!+ a)te! the event+ some peop%e ;ot as'ed that
Destion and made that point. A ,n$h o) peop%e said Than' Cod+ some,od" made that
point and then the atto!ne"s on the $ommittee I had %n$h <ith+ Ma!' Ed;e and I a!e sittin;
the!e ta%'in; to this ;" and Im ;oin; Ho 'no<+ I dont thin' "o ;"s a!e ,ein; ve!"
)o!th!i;ht <ith the peop%e that <hat "o!e !ea%%" advo$atin;. -hat "o!e ta%'in; a,ot+ "o
$ant do. Thats the point. Im %oo'in; )o!... not 'ind o) ha$'s in the s"stem+ o! 'ind o)
)e!nan;%in;+ o! I $an do it ,ette!+ o! "o ;ot the Ast ,; and its )o!teen st!o'es on "o!
'e",oa!d+ I <ant somethin; that I dont have to have on thei! s"stem+ that ha$'s the enti!e
thin; ," Ast avoidin; it. <<<.MaidSa)e.net. Ho 'eep an e"e on that and "o%% see <hat
Im ta%'in; a,ot. =K9>KL?
0M: Heah. Oe!" $oo%. E!nie+ than's a %ot. An"thin; "o <ant to addJ =K9>K5?
E1: 1!eedoms the ans<e!. -hats the DestionJ (La;hte!) =KK>77?
0M: (La;hte!) I %ove it. Ho $an )ind "o! <e,site at <<<.)!eedomsphoeni4.$om and
"o! !adio sho< is the!e. =KK>7M?
E1: (e$%a!e "o! independen$e <ith E!nest Han$o$'I Oh+ oh and "o dont need me+ "o
$an do it "o!se%)I AhJ I de$%a!ed m" independen$e see ho< eas" it <asJ (La;hte!)
=KK>85?
0M: (La;hte!) I %ove itI Than' "o so m$h E!nie. =KK>8N?
@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@
*&E"IT0:
Than's )o! %istenin; to Episode 87: o) Lets Ta%' Bit$oin.
Content )o! this episode <as p!ovided ," Emmane% o) BitC!edits+ B!ian o)
IdeaNotion+ Mi$hae% &e!'%in+ Ami! Taa'i+ 0on (em,o+ Stephanie M!ph"+ E!nie
Han$o$' and Adam B. Levine
This episode <as edited ," Adam B. Levine and (enise Levine
Msi$ )o! this episode <as p!ovided ," /a!ed 0,ens and Cene!a% 1GG
An" Destions o! $ommentsJ Emai% adamR%etsta%',it$oin.$om.
Have a ;ood oneI =KK>9M?