Organization Practice

The search for purpose

at work
Purpose is personal, but companies play a critical role in
how we express it.

© Tim E White/Getty Images

June 2021
 In this episode of The McKinsey Podcast, Naina Bill Schaninger: You know, I think one of the things
Dhingra and Bill Schaninger talk about their that’s been really challenging during the pandemic
surprising discoveries about the role of work in was a bifurcation. There were people who were
giving people a sense of purpose. An edited frontline or customer-facing or critical workers, who
transcript of their conversation follows. had to go to work in a time when livelihoods took
a back seat to lives. It felt risky.
Diane Brady: Hello and welcome to The McKinsey
Podcast. I’m Diane Brady. In this episode, we’re And that really brought front and center the idea of
talking about fascinating new research on individual “my primary purpose at this point is I have to work,
purpose, the impact that it has on companies, and and I’d like to make it home without getting sick.” But
the impact that your company has on your own for a significant other portion, people were removed
sense of purpose. Joining me are two colleagues— from the workplace while still having to do work.
first, Naina Dhingra, a partner in the New York
office. Hi, Naina. We had this unbelievable smashing together of two
worlds: the home world and the work world. I think
Naina Dhingra: Hi, Diane. Happy to be here. it’s really brought to the fore “Well, what exactly
does work mean to me? What do I have to get out of
Diane Brady: Great. And Bill Schaninger, a senior it? Is it merely a check that facilitates the rest of
partner in McKinsey’s Philadelphia office. Hi, Bill. my life or is it something more purposeful?”—using
that word quite explicitly.
Bill Schaninger: Hi, Diane.
Can we put a finer point on starting with the person
Diane Brady: So let’s start, Naina, with you. Purpose and leaving behind the arrogance that the
is a term that is tossed around quite a bit. Define it in organization thinks it dictates to people what their
this context. What’s individual purpose? purpose is? That is just nonsense. Individuals
decide what their purpose is. It’s the organization’s
Naina Dhingra: When we think about this idea role and opportunity to figure out how to help
of individual purpose, the way we think about it is it’s people bring that purpose to a finer point of what
an overarching sense of what matters in a person’s matters to them and to figure out whether or
life. I like to use the term “North Star”—this idea of not they can create a role or an experience within
having a sense of direction, intention, and the organization that helps meet that. So a big
understanding that the contribution you’re making portion of this was, one, starting with the idea that
is going somewhere. Now, that’s a technical the person was in the prime role and, two, the
definition but I think we all intuitively know what it organization was in a facilitative role, not in front.
feels like to be on purpose. It’s when you feel
energized and inspired and alive.
Defining one’s purpose through work
And it turns out, actually, in some of our research Diane Brady: Naina, I’d love to unpack purpose a bit
about 85 percent of people feel they have a purpose. more because, to Bill’s point, I often think about it at
But only about 65 percent of them believe they can the corporate level. It is something that usually
actually articulate that purpose—which we thought speaks to higher values or a higher mission. On an
was really interesting. individual level, can you give me some examples
of how people define their purpose?
Diane Brady: Bill, it feels almost like an existential
problem, our sense of purpose. Can you root it in the Naina Dhingra: When we think about employees
context of organizational health? themselves and how they think about their own

2 The search for purpose at work

 sense of purpose, one of the things that we were going to do with gusto. Time is zero sum. There
surprised to find in the research is that about are only so many hours in the day. If I’m going
70 percent of people say they define their purpose to do something, it has to work for me. And part of
through work. And, actually, millennials, even it having to work for me is that it has to work
more so, are likely to see their work as their life for others.”
calling. So what that means is that people are
looking for opportunities in the work they do day-to- I think there’s something admirable about that.
day to be actually contributing to what they I’m 51, so I’m a product of the ’80s and, you know,
believe their purpose is. Gordon Gekko,1 who was presented to us as
a nemesis and ended up becoming a folk hero.
Diane Brady: You know, I hear “life calling” and I
can’t help but think that’s a little bit sad. Bill, maybe Diane Brady: “Greed is good.”
I’m just biased here. Is work our life calling right
now because we don’t have a lot else to do but be on Bill Schaninger: Right, exactly—the Michael J. Fox
our Zoom calls and work? Is this a good thing? version of Alex P. Keaton,2 right? The archetypal
Republican mantra from the ’80s into the ’90s; it
Bill Schaninger: Well, yeah, I’ll tell you, as someone just was a different worldview. I think it’s really
who’s been trapped in a home that was supposed nice that we have people saying, “Hey, I don’t want
to be a weekend retreat, I’ve basically not left here in to be associated with people who are scumbags
14 months. I can see how we’d land at that idea. or do things that hurt the world. I want to be
Let me take a slightly different take on it. I think what associated with people who are a force for good.”
the millennials are saying to us is “Anything I do, I’m

‘One of the things that we were surprised

to find in the research is that about
70 percent of people say they define
their purpose through work. And,
actually, millennials, even more so, are
likely to see their work as their
life calling.’
–Naina Dhingra

1
A character in the 1987 film Wall Street, directed by Oliver Stone.
2
Alex P. Keaton, played by Michael J. Fox, was a character in the TV series Family Ties, which ran from 1982 to 1989.

The search for purpose at work 3

 I love that. And that doesn’t mean it’s naive. It may you start to have other people who need you in terms
be uncalibrated. It may be unspecific. of your providing care for them, then work goes from
diffuse to quite specific pretty quickly.
Certainly, some of the stuff that we found when we
were engaging with our newest joiners or our
youngest members was, as Naina was saying, the
How parenting affects purpose
difficulty to put a fine point on what the end state is. Diane Brady: Naina, one of the things that
So they could say that they know “it” has to be fascinated me in looking at this study was the fact
better and “it” has to help others. But they had a that parents, for example, place a higher premium
difficult time explaining explicitly what “it” is. on purpose. Can you talk a little bit about the slicing
As people mature—and I don’t mean age but rather and dicing of the demographics around this?
just mature in their experiences—as soon as
there is another viable claim on their time, attention, Naina Dhingra: I say this as a millennial with
and energy, then work can diminish a bit in gusto: part of the reason for the research was the
its importance. debate that Bill and I were having around the
role of purpose in one’s life and the role of work in
But it also gets way clearer the role that work has to purpose—and whether or not these were two
play. Work may have an economic contribution, distinct concepts or concepts that were actually
in terms of carrying and providing for the people you quite overlapping, particularly from the perspective
love. But you likely also start getting way more of a millennial. The findings about parents we
specific in terms of where you’d like to put in your found really interesting, particularly the fact that
time and your effort. That could be education. It parents were more than twice as likely to say
could be making people safer. It could be making that they relied on work for purpose. Time is always
better roles or jobs for communities. The whole so scarce. Given the trade-offs that parents are
point is, as you get a little further down the line and making between work and home, parents are keen

‘I think it’s really nice that we have

people saying, “Hey, I don’t want to be
associated with people who are
scumbags or do things that hurt the
world. I want to be associated with
people who are a force for good.’
–Bill Schaninger

4 The search for purpose at work

to make work time as meaningful as possible. The the idea that organizational purpose just doesn’t
time that you’re spending away from family really, matter that much. For some people, it’s just a check.
really needs to matter. And we were going back and forth on that. At a
minimum, this allowed us to come to the idea that
In a number of focus groups, parents would say that personal purpose, individual purpose, is prime.
having a child actually made and helped crystallize
their purpose and the impact on the world that they There’s an amount that people give to work or
want to have and why it matters. And so, if anything, vocation. Inside that is the space where the
it’s helped parents actually look at work and organization gets to play, and organizations have to
what they want out of work—to ask for and seek try to maximize that. Through the things they do,
more meaning in their work. One of the things they might actually expand the bit given to work or
we are looking at when we look at this choice vocation, but they should never assume that bit’s
parents make, often when they consider leaving the all of it. And then the data, when it came in, gave us
firm, is how are we ensuring that people are a really interesting understanding of how that
getting more meaning so that they feel the trade- outside circle—the whole point around individual
off is worth it and that they have the ability to purpose—just how variable that is.
fulfill their purpose at work.
Maybe one of the biggest insights is that you know
how a company can help an employee most? Help
Looking for purpose outside of work them figure out what their purpose actually is.
Diane Brady: You mentioned that you and Bill had Maybe if there was one blinding insight, it was that:
been debating prior to doing this study. I’m curious how hard a time many—particularly newer—
to know where you differed and whether this survey employees have in describing purpose with any
reinforced your beliefs or surprised you in some way. kind of specificity.
Bill, I’m going to go to you on that one.

The business case for helping

Bill Schaninger: Well, I think the earliest debate
was when I was saying we’re living in something of a
employees find purpose
gilded cage. It’s really a position of privilege. We Diane Brady: Well, it is hard. It does feel, Naina,
work for a preeminent institution. Many of us have like a personal responsibility. I think of these self-
extensive academic backgrounds. Basically, help books about finding your purpose, and it’s
these are folks on the far end of a spectrum who all about how you frame your role in the workplace.
work in knowledge roles, so we’re lucky. My push What’s the responsibility of my employer in
was that there are people who don’t look for giving me purpose?
purpose through work—that’s not how they view it.
It’s a paycheck. And that check is there because Naina Dhingra: Well, first I think we need the
they need the transactional exchange, the economic company to actually understand that there is a
exchange to pay for their obligations, their business case for this. That was actually one
responsibilities, to take care of other things. There of the other things that Bill and I were debating. Bill
are people who really just want to be skateboarders was like, “I’m a CEO. Why do I care about this
or really just want to be skiers or sailors. And stuff? Sounds a bit fluffy—send people into the
whatever they do with their gifts, work funds that. woods to think about the meaning of life. Why
are we going to convince a CEO that they should
Diane Brady: They’re called my children. care about this?”

Bill Schaninger: Yeah, exactly. So I was challenging One of the really interesting pieces that we found
Naina to say that we should get our heads around in the research is that nearly seven out of ten

The search for purpose at work 5

 ‘Nearly seven out of ten employees are
reflecting on their purpose because of
COVID-19. Those employees who say
that they live their purpose at work are
six and a half times more likely to
report higher resilience.’
–Naina Dhingra

employees are reflecting on their purpose because word games or draw a fine line there. I just think
of COVID-19. Those employees who say that they agency matters.
live their purpose at work are six and a half times
more likely to report higher resilience. They’re four Individuals have purpose. Organizations don’t give
times more likely to report better health, six times that to a person. The organization as an entity, as
more likely to want to stay at the company, and one a group of people collectively trying to do something,
and a half times more likely to go above and may have a stated, shared purpose. And you’d
beyond to make their company successful. like to believe that alignment matters there. In fact, a
good portion of the research we continue to do is
So the business case here is that when you help your about moving from the attractiveness of individuals
employees find and live their purpose at work, seeing the stated purpose of the organization to
they’ll do better and are more likely to want to stay, getting a sense of whether or not that’s real, seeing
as well as more likely to want to go above and how they could fit in, and then whether or not they
beyond. In fact, we found that as a result of COVID-19, can realize that in their daily activities—and whether
half of American employees are reconsidering the or not that firms up a sense of belonging.
work that they want to do.
So organizations can be a conduit. They can make
Diane Brady: Bill, I’m going to ask you about this. their purpose visible. They can clearly show a link
Let’s say I am a CEO. I care about my people. So how between what they’re asking a person to do and the
do I give them a sense of purpose? Is it how I define stated purpose. But the individual alone has agency
the job description? I’ve given them all these in deciding what their purpose is and whether or
benefits. I’ve tried to be compassionate. But here’s not it aligns with the company’s.
a survey saying I’m not doing a good job.
Diane Brady: One thing I want to make sure that I’m
Bill Schaninger: What they do, though, is they not mistaking, because I think often we do, is
create an opportunity for that person to live their the difference between passion and purpose. Naina,
purpose through the portion of their waking having a passion for what we do seems to be a bit
hours that’s allocated to work. I’m not trying to play

6 The search for purpose at work

overrated. Is it quite different from feeling a sense of people feel alive, they feel passionate, they
purpose in what we do? feel energized. And recognizing those areas will
help people reflect on what that sense of
Naina Dhingra: That’s an interesting question purpose is and how to find more purpose in their
because this is why, at the start, we were talking day-to-day work.
about the definition of purpose, since one can
have a purpose and have the ability to articulate it.
But then there’s also that sense of actually being
Aligning organizational and
on purpose. And that sense of truly being on purpose, personal purpose
I would say, often does come when somebody has Diane Brady: So does the organization’s purpose
a real passion for work. When you ask somebody if matter, Bill? That is the one thing leaders can
they feel like they’re doing something in line with control. What difference does it make in aligning
their purpose, they might say, “Yeah, it’s because I’m that with the individual’s purpose?
doing something I’m passionate about.”
Bill Schaninger: Well, look, the data here was
You know, one of the things I’m superpassionate surprisingly strong. This would be one of those points
about is working with people who I get to apprentice where Naina could easily say to me, “I told you so.”
and help grow. And I have passion for that and I feel When someone is looking for the time they spend at
alive when I do it. That’s me fulfilling my purpose. work to have purpose and needs alignment between
And so I think there are a lot of different words that the organization’s purpose and their own, it’s a
we can use. But, ultimately, what we’re trying to multiple win in terms of good outcomes, of employees
do is say that employers really have a role in helping wanting to stay and feeling like it’s a good place to
people reflect on what that purpose is. And part of work and for their intention to stay and strive. And it
that reflection is identifying those areas where has this huge uplift when you have a great alignment

‘The individual alone has agency

in deciding what their purpose
is and whether or not it aligns with
the company’s.’
–Bill Schaninger

The search for purpose at work 7

 between the organization’s purpose and the Diane Brady: So hypocrisy is worse than having no
individual’s purpose. What was interesting was the stated purpose at all?
context where the person wasn’t looking for the
organization to provide it, but the organization was Bill Schaninger: Well, right. You could say, “Hey, this
doing a great job of helping people be on purpose. is transactional.” There’s huge portions of the gig
economy and other places where some companies
I think the language that Naina was using there have basically tried to marginalize employees and
really matters. Being on purpose maybe sounds a say, “Oh look, they’re their own contractors.” That’s
little bit like being on brand. It’s where you’re economic exchange, not social exchange. I’m
not creating credibility problems. You’re not creating certain for some people that’s OK, but you shouldn’t
discontinuities between what you say and what try to pass it off for what it isn’t.
you do. Where you’re truly living credibly and
honestly and authentically. Even when a person
didn’t initially say, “Oh, I need this from my
Why businesses should develop an
employer,” when the employer was doing it, there authentic organizational purpose
was still an uplift. So then you had to say, “Well, Diane Brady: There’s a lot of focus right now on
what about the alternative?” wellness, Naina, and what we can do for employees,
with the recognition that certain groups—working
Well, that’s where it gets a little scary. If a person mothers and others—have really suffered during this
showed up believing the organization stood for one pandemic and have opted out of work. What are
thing and they really needed the organization’s some of the levers that you can use in this situation,
purpose to line up with their own, and then the since we can’t give people a sense of purpose
organization violated this, it was just that, a violation. other than giving them space to reflect? Is there
It had significant downticks in the person’s anything else that can be done to heighten the
willingness to stay, their engagement, their engagement and make it easier for people to feel
involvement. You’d see a direct link to performance. purpose in what they do?
Also, for most people, that creates so much
dissonance that they usually leave. Naina Dhingra: Well, let me build on what Bill was
saying—this idea of what companies can control and

‘We’ve found employees are five and

a half times more likely to say
they’re fulfilling their purpose at work
if that purpose is aligned with
their company’s.’
–Naina Dhingra

8 The search for purpose at work

this idea that there’s actually an incredible unlock kids. At that time, in the late ’60s and early ’70s, she
that happens when an individual sense of purpose is didn’t go to college. In fact, she was actually kicked
lined up with the company’s sense of purpose. out of high school. But as soon as I was, I don’t know,
We’ve found employees are five and a half times more six or something, so my sister would’ve been three,
likely to say they’re fulfilling their purpose at work if my mom had a real desire to go get a job.
that purpose is aligned with their company’s.
A good portion of that job was just that there needed
So where companies can start is understanding to be something more to her life than being a
that you’re not getting anywhere unless you have an housewife and a mom. It didn’t mean she didn’t love
authentic organizational purpose. This is a time in us or didn’t love my dad. But she needed something
which there is tremendous change going on in the for her. Some sense of freedom. Some sense of
world. Having an authentic organizational purpose is belonging to something outside the home, not being
about spending real time reflecting on the impact defined by it. And so for her, a lot of it really had to
a company has on the world. It’s not just about nice do with freedom and, to some extent, contributing to
corporate-social-responsibility contributions and the family economics. But mostly it was about
making big statements. It’s actually about engaging freedom and autonomy and being able to enjoy
your employees on what that impact is. And what something. So she ended up becoming a
we found is that employees who say their organiza­ bookkeeper—you know, accounts payable, accounts
tions spend real time reflecting on the impact receivable—and then, over the course of 20 years,
they make on the world are five times more likely to ended up running a plumbing-supply house,
be excited to work for the company. being the general manager. A rather phenomenal
arc, honestly.
These reflections and dialogues are one of the things
that we’re most excited about really helping our Diane Brady: Definitely!
clients with, and helping ourselves at McKinsey as
well. There’s an opportunity to really pause and Bill Schaninger: But a lot of that was under
reflect on the individual’s sense of purpose and how this basic idea of freedom and then enjoyment. But
that links with the company and what the company I think in her case, there was also some gender-
is trying to do for the world—especially at this norm busting, if you consider the ’70s and early ’80s.
moment, when there are so many things going on in Now, in my own case, it’s almost entirely that I get
the world that really demand business to make unbelievable enjoyment out of being good at
a greater contribution to society. something or being believed to be good at something.
Being part of a place that has such a really great
Diane Brady: You know, as we’ve been talking, I’ve institutional reputation like McKinsey.
been thinking, “What’s my sense of purpose?”
I can articulate a couple of different things that drive You know, in many conversations, Naina and I anchor
me, and I certainly feel purpose in what I do. But on this one phrase: “We’re not going to make stuff
I’d be curious to know, since you are both on the up.” Anybody can make stuff up. We’re going to make
front lines, how would you articulate your own sense sure that what we say is right. That is core to my
of purpose? Bill, I’m going to go to you first. purpose. I would have been an academic had I not
come to McKinsey. I’d be a professor somewhere,
Bill Schaninger: Yeah, it’s a great question. You teaching about behavior and HR and management.
know, throughout this conversation I was reflecting The firm has really allowed me to tap into my
on the distance between my mom and me. My mom professional purpose, which is advancing the cause
was a teen parent. She was barely 17 when I was of the human condition at work. Why do people
born and had both of her kids by the time she was behave the way they do at work? Why do leaders
20. She was a good student through school— behave the way they do at work?
and likely would’ve gone to college and then had

The search for purpose at work 9

 That was the first decade of my McKinsey career. some of the clients she’s serving. She’s personal
After I got elected partner, I started feeling a greater friends with many of them. Many of them have
and greater need. And my own personal situation had these pivotal moments in their careers and their
improved and changed, obviously. A huge portion of lives where she’s helped them.
it was, “Boy, I’ve got to do something for the kids
who are like me.” And then it went from having the At least for me, I didn’t count on how much I was
freedom, the ability to choose whether I worked going to get enjoyment and satisfaction and
or not, to things like caring and equality and security. personal pride out of helping our clients. And then,
Taking care of the ones I love, expanding beyond eventually, it just became doing not-for-profit
my immediate family to making sure my mom had a work, helping large civic institutions try to help make
house and was set up, taking care of my godchildren. everybody’s life better. And so this arc, I think it
But then I started looking around where we were can change over time. I think it usually starts with
living, and certainly here in the Lehigh Valley, in some version of freedom or caring or sustaining
Pennsylvania, it was just, “Well, how can I help kids the people around you and can migrate. And when
who were like me?” an organization plays it right, it helps people
through that progression, and it helps them see
And McKinsey helped facilitate that, either through broader opportunities so that when they excel,
not-for-profit boards or what I do with—well, everybody can excel.
frankly, excess income. Do you fund scholarships?
Do you fund summer programs? So if I compare Diane Brady: It’s very interesting to think about
and contrast the difference between my mom and the recognition of purpose and where somebody is
me, a lot of this purpose, for her, was that she in their career. Naina, I’m curious. What’s your
loved being part of something that was outside the sense of purpose?
house that she could be good at, have competence
at, and get the reward of doing what she felt she Naina Dhingra: You know, I was listening to Bill’s
could maximize to do more. story, and the way I would describe myself is truly as
an accidental consultant who, in my heart of
For me, I was afforded the luxury of always being hearts, is still the 20-year-old AIDS activist, almost
told I was going to be the first one to go to school and getting arrested at the Republican National
make something of myself, in air quotes, and then Convention. You know, throwing stones in different
I landed at McKinsey. And Naina and I were talking areas of big protests in Washington, DC. I grew
about an organization being able to help a person up as a Sikh. Religion was very important in my
define their purpose. My purpose, initially, was family. And one of the tenets of Sikhism is equality
rather narrow. It was that McKinsey was going to be and social justice and this desire to fight against
two or three years. I’d get the stories and hightail things that are not right.
it back to academics.
That was a huge part of my upbringing and really
Diane Brady: Your initial purpose. followed me in my 20s, which were about being
a social-justice activist. I somehow found myself at
Bill Schaninger: Right. Initially, the purpose was just McKinsey, in our Nonprofit Practice, and very
to make me a better academic, a better professor. much described my sense of purpose as about
I didn’t count on loving it so much. I didn’t count on equitable healthcare. I was working a lot on
realizing that, wow, we can really help change issues of AIDS in Africa, malaria, tuberculosis, and
these organizations—change the quality of the very much felt McKinsey was a place for skills
professional and personal lives of the clients training to help me fulfill that purpose. I would be
we’re working with. And I’m sure when you talk to able to fulfill that sense of purpose outside of
Naina, even 30 seconds in, there’s stories of McKinsey, but I needed greater skills.

10 The search for purpose at work

And lo and behold, ten years later, somehow I’m here organizations when someone arrives at your
as a partner. And I would say, do I still have that doorstep because it’s a job. Maybe you have an
sense of purpose? Very much. Very much. It is a core opportunity by just running the place a little
part of who I am, this idea of equitable healthcare bit better for them to see some meaning in it, to see
access. But my sense of purpose has evolved and some purpose in it.
grown through my experiences, particularly
my reflecting on what I see as the powerful role of I remember I said to my mom, “Why is it so important
business to help solve humanity’s greatest to be a bookkeeper? Why would you not want to be
challenges—as somebody who grew up in non­ at home every day when we get home from school?”
profits and grassroots campaigns and working with And my mom said to both my sister and me, “Look,
the UN, to then really seeing the platform that you just see it as a job. But it’s my job. And I need to
business has. And working with a number of clients, know that what I do there, I do really well and I’m
in particular pharmaceutical companies, and good at it.” That stuck with me quite a bit. Because if
seeing their passion and commitment toward I’m honest, as a teenager, things came naturally to
solving some of the greatest global health challenges me and I didn’t necessarily work as hard.
of our time. And so I think purpose is something;
there is an innate sense of it that I’ve had. I think she was trying to impart this idea that there is
satisfaction in doing something well that’s yours,
But there is an evolution that happens, based on that you identify with, that you affiliate with. My hope
one’s experiences, the people that one meets—and is that by engaging on this, organizations can see
that’s one of the reasons why, ten years later, an opportunity to really lay out a clear path for people
I still work at McKinsey, even though many of my and say, “This is what we stand for here at this
same friends working in many of these public- place. If you want to join us, we’re going to help you.
health institutions crack up at the idea that I’m a We’re going to help you make more meaning of it
pharma consultant and management consultant than its being just a job.” Any job can have meaning.
who works on all of these interesting topics. But still, Any job can help fulfill performance. It does require
in my heart of hearts I’m really this AIDS activist. the organization to live into it. It requires the
organization to be well run.

Why purpose matters, and I think for individuals, it’s important to see through
how to find it a lens of just how important purpose is for autonomy,
Diane Brady: What advice do you have for the two how important it is for freedom, for stability, for
thirds–plus of people out there who don’t feel caring for others, or moving into what Naina was
that sense of purpose, who certainly may be grateful talking about in terms of equality and equity.
to have a job or may be looking for a job? What can You may not fulfill all of them but you can certainly
they be doing to ignite a sense of purpose in fulfill some of them. And I think one of the things
themselves if their employers are not doing it? Bill? we’re seeing is that as people have more time, they
have more affinity. They have more belonging.
Bill Schaninger: Yeah, I was just reflecting on your They have more attachment to what the organization
question. It’s a really good one. I’ve often thought is doing and what they’re doing individually. So
that when talking about this, I wanted to make sure maybe it becomes a bit of a virtuous cycle and it can
that I wasn’t forgetting the very real condition be reinforcing.
for a lot of people, which is that employment is
necessary. It’s necessary so they can put food on Diane Brady: Great. Naina, any thoughts that
the table and a roof over the heads of the people you have for listeners out there who may or may not
they love. I don’t think we should ever look past that be feeling a sense of purpose?
or diminish it. I do think there’s an opportunity for

The search for purpose at work 11

 Naina Dhingra: I would offer two simple questions Bill Schaninger: Thank you; it was a great
to reflect on over a month, every day. When did conversation.
I feel most alive today? When did I feel most
drained? I think reflecting on those two questions Naina Dhingra: My pleasure. Thank you.
over a 30-day period may offer some really
interesting insights about how you might feel about Diane Brady: And thank you to the listeners out
what’s going on at work, what’s going on in your there. Whether you have found your purpose or not,
life, and help you on a path to reflecting on what that you’ll certainly find more information on how to
sense of purpose might be. nurture it within your company and nurture it within
yourself at McKinsey.com. I’m Diane Brady. I look
Diane Brady: I think that’s great advice. I can’t think forward to seeing you next time.
of a better place to leave than that. Naina Dhingra,
Bill Schaninger, thank you very much for joining us.

Naina Dhingra is a partner in McKinsey’s New York office, and Bill Schaninger is a senior partner in the Philadelphia office.
Diane Brady is a senior editor in the New York office.

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12 The search for purpose at work