20

24
FEB

AVNL TIMES
®

Your weekly dose of happenings around the community

EDITOR-IN-CHIEF
Deux von Pervertheim XIII

ART DIRECTOR
Dylan Lei D. Fucher

WRITERS
Cultured Pervs

PHOTOGRAPHERS/ILLUSTRATORS
Devs, Cultured Pervs

GRAPHIC DESIGNER
Stanley

MARKETING/SALES MANAGER
Bella vas Quib-quib, Nika Adidas

CIRCULATION MANAGER
Kindra Tortelini

PRODUCTION MANAGER
Liam Mobile, Chris La Moustache

www.avnltimes.com
[email protected]
CONTENTS Volume 02
Issue No. 01

01 04

On Writing an Adult Visual Novel

Featured Article Creating a
Connection

Editor’s Message
とかくに人の世は住みにくい。
山路を登りながら、こう考えた。住みに
07 14
くさが高じると、安い所へ引き越したく
なる。とかくに人の世は住みにくい。情
に棹させば流される。
情に棹させば流される。意地を通せば
窮屈だ。情に棹させば流される。情に Are AVNs good
棹させば流される。山路を登りながら、 for people?
こう考えた。

住みにくさが高じると、安い所へ引き越
したくなる。智に働けば角が立つ。意
18
地を通せば窮屈だ。とかくに人の世は
住みにくい。山路を登りながら、こう考
えた。とかくに人の世は住みにくい。意
地を通せば窮屈だ。住みにくさが高じる
と、安い所へ引き越したくなる。どこへ Community
越し
—deux
Threads
Discussions. Memes. Shitposting. Advertisements
 Featured Article

On Writing an
Adult Visual
Novel
By: Joshua
Writer, Race of Life

Ideas that worked and lessons I learned So here are some things I’ve learned. Some may work
for you, some may not. I’m not anyone special, so don’t
when writing Race of Life.
treat it as the final word in all of this, because after all,
I’m still learning (and will probably never stop learning).
I’ve been asked a few times about my approach to writing,
So think of this as a way to skip a bit of staring at a blank
so I figured I’d publish some insights on what worked for
page when you want to write. If you think what I’ve written
me, and what did not. It’s not the only way to do things—
sounds like it won’t work for you, that’s fine. There is more
far from it—so feel free to adapt whatever is in here.
than one way to write goodly.
I’ve also played games (and watched TV series, movies,
and read books) where the premise was awesome, but
The Premise
Have you ever had a group of friends around and they’ve
the execution sucked so badly that I just couldn’t continue
said “We should start a YouTube channel!” or “We should
with it.
buy a bar!”? Everyone is excited, especially when they
come up with some cool theme or content ideas. “We’re
And that’s a real shame.
going to stream pranking my neighbour” or “Our bar will
feature a clear glass pool in the middle!” And the ideas
I hope that after reading this, someone who always wanted
may be brilliant. They may get everyone in the group so
to write a story has the confidence to do it, and to do it
enthusiastic that they immediately start googling venue
in a way that other people connect with. Whether you’re
costs or equipment rental. Maybe they even get a cool
writing a novel or a porn game, creating something
logo or profile pic made up.
that people you’ve never even met can enjoy and feel
connected to is something incredible. You feel seen, and
But then, it kind of goes nowhere. Everyone just stalls and
appreciated (even when they’re screaming out for the next
loses momentum because they don’t know how to actually
update to be released asap).
start a business (which is what it is). They just had a good

Ah... rekindling an old flame.

02
idea, not a good plan. So the premise is very important, and that kind of pay off… you know what, forget that
but plenty of good ideas fail because they’re not planned example.
out. I’m sure we all know a cool shop, bar or restaurant
that went broke even though it was fun. That’s probably I generally follow the ‘hero’s journey’ model. Most good
because they had a great idea and probably had the stories do, whether you realise it or
initial ability and enthusiasm to make it work, but couldn’t not.
keep it up. It’s the same with an AVN.
Heroes journey
You start with big ideas, a whole load of them. And it’ll This is a story template where the protagonist is usually
be awesome, people will love them. Then a month later, a fairly average person, who is then challenged by a
suddenly you’re bogged down and can’t figure out where huge, seemingly insurmountable obstacle, and is called to
you’re going. That’s the hard part about AVNs. The writing action to overcome it. During the opening of the story, the
is fairly straightforward and doesn’t take all that much audience understands what the ending conditions of the
time. It’s the rendering, coding and animations that end story will be (slay the dragon, find your son, rescue the girl,
up chewing up your day. destroy the Terminator… that sort of stuff). The start and
end are mostly known and understood immediately.
Plan
So many writers of all genres write themselves into a
corner. They either put their protagonist in an inescapable
situation, then use bullshit to get them out of it, or they
don’t have a specific end scenario mapped out, so the
story bogs down as they throw random shit
into the mix.

So when you’re getting ready to write your story, plan it Meet Jake, a 30-something divorcee rebuilding his life.
out.
During the actual story, the character evolves from an
average person, and through hardship and a decisive
Start with the ending. I know it sounds counter-intuitive,
victory of some sort, returns a changed person, with
but this is the ultimate payoff of your story. Plan how that
benefits and capabilities he didn’t have before.
will look in general for your protagonist. Then flesh out
how it will look for their chosen love interest(s). You don’t
The middle details all progress the story to bring the
need to be too detailed, just a general idea.
climactic finale ever closer while allowing the protagonist
to gain the tools they need to win. Usually, they’ll attempt
Then, plan the start. For AVNs that release episodically,
to overcome the obstacle early on and fail miserably,
you need a great hook. If all the cool shit is happening in
getting to their lowest point (i.e. Luke Skywalker losing a
episodes 4,5 or 6, you’re gambling that you’ll make it that
hand to Vader in Empire Strikes Back). They then regroup
far. Give them a reason to give a shit about the protagonist
and, with the help of a mentor or team, push themselves
and the story.
past their previous limits to become a person capable of
defeating their enemy.
During the start, you should indicate where the story will
take them. You don’t have to show the whole plan, but
You can have side plots, mini-arcs and so on, but for an
at least give them a victory condition. Think of it like a
AVN, they should always be either advancing the main
massive RPG game. In Fallout 4, you’re looking for your
plot, introducing necessary characters or plot points, or
son, and that payoff happens in the end. In The Witcher 3,
advancing the relationship between the protagonist and
you’re trying to escape the Wild Hunt, and that’s resolved
a potential love interest.
in the end. In Starfield, you’re trying to… collect… stuff…

03
Plot out your story Jasmine: “As IF!”
Jasmine: “I was just… reacting in the moment.”
So, once you have a general plan, start plotting your story.
Jake: “Uh huh.”
Divide it up into the number of chapters you intend to have Jasmine: “I was!”
(a rough guess is fine, it’ll probably change later though). Alexa suddenly appears beside both of them
Your first third is about setting the scene, the middle third Alexa: “HEY GUYS!”
is where your character is brought to their lowest, and They’re surprised.
starts the climb back to being the person they need to be, Alexa: “What are you guys whispering about?”
and the final third is where they complete the main story
and win their victory. So the render comments aren’t detailed but give a little
prompt on how the story can be told visually as well. Your
Now plot out the key points of each chapter for your artist may have different ideas, and that’s fine. Finding a
protagonist to advance the main story. After that’s done, middle ground is always important in a team project.
plot out the key points for each love interest in those
chapters. Even if they’re not introduced yet, give them Write to music
some backstory. Assume your protag is only interested in Personally, I need music in my ears when I write. Pretty
them and their arc when you do (even for harem games, much when I need to focus on anything, I will have some
each member of the harem should be a little different). sort of background music.

Now, you have a story plot that you can work with. I try to make playlists that match the tone of what I’m
writing. If I’m writing something fast-paced or high-
Make a routine energy, it’ll generally be some sort of metal or hard rock.
Now, all you need to do is flesh out the details. Easy, right? Something slower or romantic will be ballads and love
But this is the hardest part. Writing every line, every render songs. That sort of thing.
idea, every variable and every choice path. You won’t
always feel like doing it, especially when it’s a scene that Creating a connection
you’re using as a linker between cooler stuff. The best advice I ever got for any writing was that nothing
matters as much as creating an emotional resonance in
But, it’s gotta be done. So make a routine. Even if it’s just the reader. Not grammar, not style, not font… nothing.
an hour per night, or half a day every Tuesday, work at
it. Stick to your routine as much as you can. There will be Miyamoto Musashi once said that it doesn’t matter if a
times when it sucks, but spending the time to make useful sword cuts from left to right or ground to sky, as long as
habits will help later. it cuts.

Write to the render Your words should be the same.

If, like me, you aren’t the person rendering the story, you
need to be able to help prompt what the render should
look like. Don’t make it hard for the artist. Even if you are
the person rendering, adding details as you write will help
remind yourself about your mental image of the story later
on.

I usually write it to look something like this:

Jake looks at Jasmine and smirks.

Jake: “As I remember it…”
Jake “You were the one who kissed me.”
Jasmine pokes a finger in Jake’s chest.
Ah... rekindling an old flame.

04
Connect with the reader through emotions. Write about Some people like to release a short prologue to build
things that people can relate to—love, loss, joy, regret, interest. In theory, it’s not a bad idea, as you can then
frustration, fear, triumph… Everyone remembers their first monetise your project through patreon or similar sites
love, and their heartbreak, even (and perhaps especially) while you’re working on the actual release, but most of
if both were unrequited. the time I’ve seen people gain 5-10 patrons at most from a
small prologue.
The same goes for any personal triumph that they worked
hard to achieve. We may not tell everyone about that time I’d recommend spending lots of time on Chapter 1.
we won the game for our team in third grade, or when we Give them a good amount of content, and polish the
finally climbed the tallest tree in the park after being too story. No grammar or spelling errors. No bugs. Plenty of
afraid to try before, but we remember it within ourselves. foreshadowing that will be understood in hindsight.

Making your story draw out those emotions and memories While you’re writing Chapter 1, there is no time constraint.
in the audience takes some talent, but also some work. No people yelling “When is the next release!”. It’s fantastic
to have a committed fandom, but they will feel like you’re
I generally try to add emotional targets to my story plot. taking advantage if you’re not updating them on progress.
I’ll add to the outline what emotion I want to trigger in the If your first three months post-release for chapter 1 is spent
reader for that part. It doesn’t always have to be positive, fixing errors rather than writing the follow-up chapter, well,
it might even they’ll be pissed and they’ll let you know.
mean you want them to dislike a character close to the So spend the time to make it as good as you can. Spend
protagonist, solely so you can flip the narrative later when some time working on the follow-up if possible, while
they realise that the character is actually very different to tweaking the other parts of the game. You should try to
what they assumed. get your second release out within six months if possible,
but if it comes down to honouring a deadline or delivering
Don’t write about a job, write about a person a high-quality game, choose quality. Better to deal with
Your story will probably have characters with a profession. the fallout of asking people to wait a month than giving
Maybe they’re a police officer, a Doctor a Priest or whatev- them something that sucks, because they’ll feel that all
er. Don’t write about a Cop, Doctor or a Priest, write about the time waiting up until now was wasted.
someone whose job it is to be a Cop, Doctor or Priest.
Talk to your audience.
Think about why they took that job. Was it the family No matter how good your work is, after you’ve read and
tradition? Was it to escape poverty? Was it with intent to re-read it dozens of times, you’ll probably doubt yourself.
subvert the role for their own gain? Give the characters “Is this actually funny?” “Will people understand this
depth. You don’t need an entire backstory, but a few reference?” “Should the audience understand what the
paragraphs of detail will help you find the voice of the dog is saying?”. Most writers—whether they’re writing
character. an essay or an acceptance speech for a Nobel Prize for
literature— have at some time or another suffered from
It’s hard to connect with a cookie-cutter character. That imposter syndrome.
may be fine for background characters, but for your main
people, you want them to have nuance. Build up their So, you need to be in contact with your audience. The
character, then show a little more of it in every interaction. easiest way is to have a small team of beta readers who
are willing to offer feedback on what works and what
Take your time with Chapter 1. doesn’t. You don’t need to always follow that feedback,
Your first chapter sets the scene for the whole story. You but you should be aware of the possible reactions to
need to get it right. what you’re writing.

05
Other ways are with polls and updates. You should keep
your audience aware of how the project is progressing,
otherwise, they might think you’ve abandoned it. Once
that concern is raised, you’ll struggle to attract patrons. No
one wants to fund someone that they think will abandon
the project.

Write the story you wish you read.

The single most important thing (in my opinion) is writing a
story that you wish you could have read before.

Take advice from people, but ultimately, it’s your name (or
pen name) attached to it. You need to be happy with it. If it
sucks, everyone who advised you to do things their way is
unlikely to take responsibility. That will fall on you, no
matter what you do. So if you’re going to take the blame,
you may as well do it for a story that you’re proud of.

I think that right now we’re in a really exciting time for

AVNs. There has been an amazing leap in quality of
stories and graphics in the last few years. It has meant
that the landscape is now more competitive and that the
player base demands better quality, but the audience is
also expanding. It’s still a niche, but it’s a niche where a
few people can actually make a living. That number may
also grow once people can justify the time invested.

Chances are, for just about everyone involved, making

AVNs will just be a hobby, but, if the story is compelling,
the game is engaging, and you are keeping your audience
informed and along for the ride, you give yourself every RACE OF LIFE
chance of turning your game into something that people Underground Studios
will enjoy and support.
Meet smoking hot women, participate
About the Author in illegal street races, win money, and
Joshua is a professional writer, based in Australia. achieve your goal!
He is currently the writer for Race of Life by Underground
Studios. You can follow their progress on Patreon here: Have fun guiding Jake’s life and
https://www.patreon.com/undergroundstudio/posts choose the best path (and the sexiest
woman) possible.
Race of Life will also be released on Steam in 2024. You
can wish-list it here:
https://store.steampowered.com/app/2454570/Race_of_
Life__Act_1

06
DISCUSSIONS. MEMES. SHITPOSTING.
COMMUNITY
THREADS
 Discussion

What are your

thoughts on
animations in AVNs?
By: u/KnightOfArsford

RED MOON
City of Broken Dreamers

Especially in sex scenes. Is it an absolute It’s an (A)dult (V)isual (N)ovel, and a huge emphasis on
the last letter. If it’s not one of those sandbox/mini-game/
requirement for you? I’ve played plenty
interactive/hidden object/Match 3 games, there should be
of games and I’m in the firm belief that more work put into the story itself. Speeds up the release
they’re not required, and that times too.
“Oh sorry, dear patron, we’re moving the release date from
“no animation is better than bad animation”. first quarter this year to second quarter next year because
we absolutely have to add 4K 60fps animations in our
I recently started Pale Carnations, and after the first scene, game.”
I realized it wasn’t even fully animated. It was just static
images but it works. It still is a good scene because of the Like music, art style, voice acting, etc. Animations are a tool.
dialogue, the renders, and the various effects used. I think They help to elevate what is already there.
Out of Touch also follows the same format on scenes. Good animations won’t single handedly fix a bad story, and (at
least to me) bad animations won’t ruin a good story.

On the other hand, I’ve played games where they put But when everything is doing its job, it works to elevate the AVN
heavy emphasis on animations but fell flat because the to greater heights.
animations are too stiff, the angles used were unflattering, —u/solarpoweredmess
or there was bad or no music at all. I couldn’t even notice
that a scene forgot or didn’t implement animations, but I’d Most animations in AVN’s are pretty short and pretty bad by
definitely notice my game stuttering when a dev tries to conventional, 3d animation standards. Like...Playstation 1 level.
sneak in a random 60 fps heavy animation in the ol’ Ren’py —u/ivyentre
engine. Don’t have a bad rig myself, btw. Sometimes it just
stutters.

08
I agree with no animation being better than bad animation. Good animations are always a great addition, although it’s not
Though aside from most of the reasons already mentioned here, the main point I played in visual novels.
it’s because I have a potato laptop and it’s so bad some RenPy
games can’t even load images without them splitting in half and Execution of story and romance is always the priority for me.
misaligning. And I have played through a game where too many I’ve been playing visual novels for a decade and the majority of
consecutive animations wind up crashing the game so I have to those are filled with visual novels with no animation at all.
save after a couple of scenes at a time just to push through.
—u/blessedbetheslacker I’d even say that great voice acting is far better than great
animation, but using voice actors is a rarity in “western” adult
No animations is better than bad animations. Good renders and visual novels. But that’s just my opinion.
good writing are what defines a game and even for lewds they —u/GreyWarden194
can make a huge difference. Look at Game of Hearts, the lewds
have such a great atmosphere and are very erotic because of Some animations are so wildly good that they blow my mind.
how good the writing and the renders are, the animations are Hellcat lounge is definitely one. Their animations are absurdly
good but not stellar. good. It adds a whole new layer to the game. I have also seen
animations that were so bad I couldn’t play the gake anymore.
If you can really depict a lewds scene in the mind of the reader So, like others have said, great animations > no animations >
with words and stills, the animations become the cherry on top, bad animations.
even if they are simple and minimal. —u/Kuke69
—u/Shot-Usual4535
Good animation > No animation > Bad animation
I prefer no animation over bad animation. —u/ZenMyst
btw The best animations I’ve seen were the Ocean’s cinematics
and COBD. I think the vast majority of animations bring little or nothing
—u/Electronic-Way1003 to the game. I also think devs need to keep putting em in.
Animations can’t get better if people don’t keep trying to do
Yes it’s a requirement for me but the animations don’t have much them. No one starts out as good at them. Very few animations
impact if the story and character building isn’t on point. Those are going to be up to the quality that Ocean, or DrPC or Classy
two aspects make animations or sex scenes in general great Lemon put in theirs, but they weren’t amazing to start either.
imo. The perfect game for me achieves a balance between great They got better. And now the animations in Projekt Passion, SG
character building that eventually leads to good sex scenes and BaD really help to make the game.
with animations that feel rewarding because the game made
me care about those characters. If any of that is missing I lose Also, I actually prefer non-lewd animations. They can bring
interest pretty quickly. some pop to important scenes. Lewd animations really lock a
dev into specific angles and positions. I prefer a diversity within
I guess you could say I’ve been spoiled as there are quite a few each scene there, and I think that static renders do that better. A
games that achieve this balance and those are the games that big drawback of them is that they vastly increase development
make it to my “best games” list. time of updates. Its a tradeoff I guess. I get why devs put in even
—u/Upper_Cut4943 5 second loops. People seem to want even those over nothing.
And 5 second loops lead to 10 second loops which eventually
I agree with the focus on story over animations. They are a huge leads to actual good animations.
bonus if done right. One of my favorite AVNs is Chasing Sunsets —u/johnman300
and it doesn’t have animations. Yet they do it so well it is, imho,
the hottest one I’ve seen. Most animations look bad because the developers tried to do
—u/Whiskeyrich it themselves but there are professional who can make wicked
animations.

Personally I prefer if the sex scenes have a natural feel and flow,
not just a sequence of images or animations. (Game of Hearts
would be a positive example.) It might be easier to do it with
static renders but there are still to many devs who mess up sex
scenes with static renders.

09
 Conclusion: I don’t expect animations but I expect realistic sex
scenes. If those have animations it’s fine for me.
But Pale Carnations has some hot if not the hottest animations,
so just continue and enjoy
—u/shyLachi

Great question! I think Devs will go out of their way to at least

try to incorporate animations...no matter what, because it casts
a wider net. It’s a ton of work to put these AVNs together and
you don’t want to exclude potential readers right off the bat. This
is true for myself. I’m still working on making the animations
better, and will probably redo all of them once I figure out how
to best create them within my limitations. Be interesting to see
what the consensus here is.
—u/Mr_PocketRocket Game Developer

I have mix feelings on this. Cause I dont play any AVN’s to fap or
for the porn / lewds it’s not as big of a deal.

However I feel like ive played to many with them that it’s kind of
a standard to me. To the point I don’t mind if they suck I just want
animations now, as to me even bad ones make the lewd scenes
feel better. However with that being said it isn’t a deal breaker
if it’s a good game. Maybe if I play more without animations
ill change my mind where it feels like it’s needed to enjoy lewd
scenes. As of right now only played like 1- 5 I can think of that
didn’t have any or were mostly static than animations.
—u/Dessolos

Left: Kindra (Artemis), Top: Nika (Summer’s Gone), Ashe (Projekt Passion)

CLICK HERE
to see more of this thread

10
 Discussion

The Obsession
with Incest
By: u/InternetCitizen0

JAYE
Chasing Sunsets

I’m probably far from the only person to I hope it slows down and there’s more stuff like Intertwined
where the incest is just teased at most, but all the LIs are not
have thought about this, but why is there blood-related.
such an obsession with incest in AVNs? —u/virtualdreamscape
If it’s not people asking for it, it’s them
outright demanding it in the game. Incest and cuckolding are the mainstream fetishes of the Zoomer
and Alpha generations of men.

Maybe I sound like a prude, but I genuinely don’t get it. Maybe of Millenials, too. But how can this be? This is a
philosophical take but bear with me:
IDK about incest but I think there’s too much sex with landladies Popular fetishes change over time. What one generation
in AVNs. Clearly caused by the dire state of real estate market fetishizes another may not. That’s because fetishes are a
and high prices of rent in developed world. result of societal pressures during the formative years of male
—u/Sufficient_Bug1367 adolescence.

I don’t try to understand other people fetishes, as long as no one Puberty is when males form the synapses in their brain that link
is getting hurt I say go for it. Now, I’ll explain why I love that their desires to their penis. Research suggests, as documented
tag, more with mother/aunt. The thing is that the usual way this in the book “A Billion Wicked Thoughts,” that while these
type of characters are portrayed is with big/tall women, huge connections are malleable, they largely go unchanged--and in
leggs or asses or boobs, mature features both in body desing fact are reinforced over time--as boys mature into men.
and personality, that sort of thing I deeply enjoy, so my preffer What does that mean? Your fetish from childhood is likely the
tag is milf, but when I see a mother or aunt character, I have a same stuff you jack off to as an adult.
good chance to get what I want to see.
Now, in what environment are kids growing up these days?
—u/Federal-Room-9812
Answer: An environment that is bereft of sociability (COVID,
distance learning, work at home, the internet).
I used to find it good but there’s just so many going around now,
and 99% of them have terrible writing which makes me quit and
Zoomers and Alphas are a sexless and relationshipless
delete the game most of the time.
generation. There’s articles upon articles to show this trend.
So what outlet do shut-in boys have for their sexual expression?
What relationships can they draw from, in their closed

11
 environments, as a conduit for their sexual desire? have to set up any romance. You don’t see that connection build.
Even cats and dogs in a closed space will end up fucking their They’re always around each other and they already know each
sisters and mothers. other. They don’t need to have some chance meeting.

The incest trend is the fetish of the new generation, and you will 2) Illogical writing. Typically the game is set up that MC and his
only see it grow and expand over time. “roommate” never really had any interest in each other (or it was
—u/ChadChan3d one sided lust). Then suddenl ”it just happens” for no real reason.
Like...why?
I am of the mind every fetish and taboo should get as much love/
representation in AVNs as incest does. 3) The game setting up situations where full blooded incest
seems to be embraced by MCs friends. This is supposed to be
Obviously not within the same game, but every flavour should a taboo subject. Yet MCs friends will constantly comment on
have at least five masterpieces to its name. the attractive women in MCs house and say things like “If I had
a hot roommate (sister) like that I’d never leave home.” Tell me
—u/DiGreatDestroyer
everyone, especially the men here. Have you ever had someone
say that to you? Ever? That would be fucking weird as shit and
Nah it’s mostly a dude trying to sleep with his Landlady or you’d kick them out immediately.
Roommate? Or his Landlady’s Roommate?
—u/Adept_Department2301 4) MC being depicted as hella pervy. Half the start of the game
is Voyeristic stuff and it can escalate from there. Looking at you
I think it’s a combination of being one of the more “better” “Lust Theory”. I understand some people like Voyerism, but some
taboos, and that you kinda get to skip the whole meeting of that gets borderline rapey. And it’s often required to continue
someone and getting to know them part and start out already the path which is not cool.
being really close.
—u/Charl8t 5) The nature of the taboo relationship leaving everything under
wraps almost too convenientley which means MC is basically
Purely the taboo. But it is also used a lot as it is easy access (i.e. free to screw whoever he wants and everyone will keep it to
you live with them/see them often), you know... all the ‘Oops, I themselves.
walked into the bathroom while you were naked’ etc...
I can tolerate step sibling relationships but it can suffer from the
—u/Old_Administration51
same stuff. Personally the games I’ve seen that handle this best
are:
It’s definitely not my thing. I’ll play a game that has it, but I have
to compartmentalize that part of my brain off. As far as why 1) Sunshine Love from Mr. DotsGames. This is censored (which
people like it: is the only one I’ve played but you can kinda read between
the lines) and the plot isn’t exactly amazing but it at least feels
A) Taboo. understandable why they are drawn together.

B) While there should be definitive limits to this, some people 2) Chasing Sunsets - I haven’t played all the way through the
like things they would never want to do in real life for a host of available updates and from where I finished it was kinda wishy
reasons. I mean...like sleeping with your brother’s wife is a hot washy on exactly the relationship (familial wise) between MC
fantasy in some of these games. But like...could you imagine and the two primary LI. Though this specifically refers to Jaye.
how that would impact a family if that got out? You can see how they got to where they are and can sympathize
with them.
C) Some people have mentioned a “sibling bond”. I am not sure I
see that, but I’ll just take their word for it. 3) Once in a Lifetime: This is step family (even if the setup seems
like it’s meant to be more normal ones) that actually hits a LOT of
It’s not my kink but I’ll not immediately toss something if it my pet peeves above. But the characters and their interactions
contains that as long as there are more redeemable parts of the are extremely charming. You can genuinely feel the love grow,
story. My main issue when it incest is included is it can *lead* to: especially for Judy and Lauren. The game also has a really
entertaining story that can offset all this.
1) Lazy writing. Having a male MC pursue a family member
—u/Ksteekwall21
requires no effort for setup. The two already know each other,
already have a connection, and live in the same house. You don’t

12
I’m going to add my theory to the mix based on my experience. For me, it’s trust and intimacy. Sibling relationships can easily
There aren’t as many incest fans out there as you think there be idealized to this amazing bond that, while on the surface
are, just like there aren’t that many harem fans out there as one might be full of squabbles and conflict, is truly and genuinely
would think. Players want this for other reasons, not all but a deep and caring. As in, you would actually put your life on the
good portion imo. line for your sibling. Or as in, they know your true self and you
trust them with it.
Let’s look at the harem topic first. I’ve enjoyed many harem
games but not because I actually like harems lol, I think it’s the And since this is the ultimate ideal for romantic relationships
stupidest concept and wildly unrealistic, so why do I like them? too, there’s a certain appeal to combine those. Nothing warms
Because I can interact with all the girls in the game increasing my heart as much in fiction as a brother taking care of his sister
the amount of content I get from the game in general. (baby sister mainly, but works for older or twin sisters as well), so
by adding a romantic and sexual aspect to it it’s sort of a brain
Most games that make you choose one girl, I never end up exploit to get extra lovey dovey feelings.
replaying. In these games, you generally have to replay 80%
of the content over and over again to experience that last 20% Real Life relationships are often defined as part of a wider
differently with another girl. That’s too much repeated content I community / society instead of the classic romantic true
have to sit through and imo a lot of games aren’t good enough person-to-person relationship; and they to some extent are more
to sit through 80% of the content 5 times, to see every girl. So between people’s personas in that context; or even altogether
I favor the harem to extend the first playthrough of the game transactional. AVNs can be so appealing because they can
which is almost always the best playthrough. Let’s use Being a make relationships feel truly intimate and genuine; and sisters
DIK as an example. It’s not a great example because Being a DIK are like the perfection of that concept. That’s at least how I
actually is interesting enough to play multiple times but I’ll use would explain my own obsession with it :D
it as an example anyways. Play a branch with any girl, you get —u/PM_ME_SANSA_NUDES
a certain amount of hours until you reach the end. Now imagine
being able to romance every girl, the game would be 5 times
as long. This is why the others branch is one of my favorites,
there’s so much going on with so many various girls and while
the MG stories are interesting, they just can’t compare in terms
of content. A “monk” playthrough is pretty boring. It’s satisfying
being able to tell J&M that they were the only ones other than
Zoey that you’ve slept with, but that playthrough is pretty
bland. You avoid a lot of content. But like I said, Being a DIK is
probably a bad example but you get the point.

As far as incest goes, I don’t get actual sibling feelings from most
if any of these games. To me it’s just a hot looking character in
an AVN. Some games add a hot sister and don’t add the option
to romance them, for me that’s a waste of space unless the story
is really good and let’s be honest, a good story is pretty rare.
While there are a lot of good game developers out there, they
aren’t authors. They aren’t experienced writers. So unless you are
really good at writing a story, that “sister” is nothing but another
love interest in an AVN to me.

So while there certainly are those who get off on being in a

harem for some odd reason and those who get off on incest,
I’d be willing to bet many players request these things for other Nami x Nika (Summer’s Gone)
reasons.
—u/Upper_Cut4943

CLICK HERE
to see more of this thread

13
 Discussion

Are AVNs good

for people?
By: u/Zoltar22

BODYGUARD-KUN
Hillside

I’ve been thinking quite a bit lately about The point is that, when you get to be immersed in the
story, the game time is very enjoyable, and even think
whether AVNs do people good or the
about the game at other times of the day. I think that if a
exact opposite. person plays AVN in certain moments of their life, maybe it
is because they are not going through their best moment,
I would like to make a small personal introduction to give
this causes that if you are very interested in some stories,
you some more background (if you are not interested in
you will want to know how they end, but for that, there
this part I will continue with the question at the end of the
are years to wait. I don’t know if it’s good to “tie ourselves”
post).
to this kind of games for years, taking into account that,
perhaps, the problem of not being at 100% mentally, is
I began my AVN journey in 2020, started with BaDIK, loved
aggravated by waiting for the endings of the stories.
it, finished it, and stopped playing AVN for a few years
until I came back a few weeks ago. I saw the new chapters
Do you think AVNs are good for people who are struggling?
of BaDIK announced and decided to play it again. This
I would love to hear what you think, thank you!
time, it left me wanting more than last time, so I decided
to play Acting Lessons, finished it, and enjoyed it a lot too. I applaud you for asking this question. It maybe deeper than
I still wanted to continue with AVNs, so I started Summer’s many here think.
Gone. Two days ago I finished it and it has become my My personal opinion is that if you feel like it is bad when you
favorite on par with BaDIK (or maybe a little less so). start a new one, you probably should find a different way to
spend time. I would also say that if you are using AVNs instead
of real sexual experiences for gratification it is definitely bad for
The problem I have now, and the reflection I want to make,
you.
is that I’m not sure to what extent visual novels are good
for us players, on a mental level of course. I don’t know if As a 70 year old man who has had wonderful experiences, I use
anyone has the same feeling as me when playing AVN, AVNs as a reminder of how it felt to be sexually active. (Some
whenever I start a new one, I have a strange feeling in my of these stories are reminiscent of the pre-aids, birth control pill
body, like knowing that “there’s something I’m not doing days). I wouldn’t trade my experiences for any amount of adult
pictures and I hope the guys in this sub are spending the effort
right”.
IRL to do the same.
—u/Whiskeyrich

14
I think they are great if you take them for what they are - *a your balls, working, going to the gym, I think you get the point.
game,* like a book, TV show or movie, etc... If you’re in a bad mental headspace or struggling with addiction
and come to the realization that AVNs are not good for you and
They can make you lament about better times, or some people, I just cut it off cold turkey without actually taking the time to
suspect, may use them for more cathartic reasons (maybe after properly deal with whatever the issue is causing that to occur at
a breakup, for e.g.) it’s root then all you’re going to end up doing is replacing AVNs
with something else.
Like most other media, I do not think they pose an issue for
normal, stable people. I cannot speak for people who may be in The thing people do or consume that fucks them up isn’t the
a different headspace, but there are usually trigger warnings at issue. It’s WHY they are doing/consuming it to such a degree
the start of most games. that it’s negatively impacting their lives/relationships that’s the
problem. If you don’t address the why then removing the thing/
It may be wise to investigate or vet a certain AVN before jumping substance from your life won’t actually solve shit.
in, especially if you are not in a good place in your life.
But overall I think most can have a positive impact. (Just realise As for getting a strange feeling in your body that you’re
that you are not an AVN character and people won’t throw somehow not doing something “right” that’s entirely in your
themselves at you the second you walk into a room, lol). head. That sounds like you’re shaming yourself into thinking
—u/Old_Administration51 something you enjoy is somehow not good for you. If you
enjoy doing it then you enjoy doing it. Own it. I’m not saying go
AVNs are definitely good for people who suffer from social around broadcasting you like to play AVNs, I mean people don’t
anxiety and loneliness.I don’t have friends in real life but I don’t usually walk around openly talking about the kind of porn they
care..i turn on my laptop and play some relationship building watch, but if you wouldn’t feel bad watching some porn then I
AVNs like Summer’s gone and it keeps me busy worrying less really don’t see why you should feel bad playing an AVN. Shit
about the real world they’re basically just romance novels for dudes at this point.
—u/MIrkey
I never knew many sexual things people are in like kinky,
voyeurism, incest,etc.(still learning tho) For me, AVNs are a safe place. I was severely depressed and
still wouldn’t say I’m fully recovered, but AVNs helped me. It
I relate to AVNs character more than people and get into let me live a life different from my own, one that was better in
discussion in subreddits or forums..it’s just an amazing feeling! every way. I’ve learned that I can actually make that happen
So far I’m enjoying it and not planning to give up. in my real life, as long as I’m willing to try. (Thank You Ocean
—u/Most_Rich1100 specifically). So if it depends on the person and their reasoning
for playing AVNs.
I’ve read about people becoming better fathers, husbands, —u/Dangerous-Freedom424
homewreckers, friends and siblings (lovers) with the help of
AVNs. I say they are a very good thing as long as you play in moderation
and set boundaries as fun as AVN can be they are still at the end
Truly a blessing. of the day fantasy and are not real life there should always be
—u/Acid_Dispenser that distinction, but with that said I found that many AVN share
some valuable life lessons about relationships, friendship and
You can say this about literally anything. And I’m not just talking can motivate people to better themselves.
about the fun stuff like porn, drugs, gambling, and alcohol.
I personally started going to the gym and found the motivation
People need to stop framing addiction as only being associated to change my diet to a much healthier one because of AVN
with what’s considered morally questionable. The legality or seeing so many characters in AVN working out is inspiring in a
“moralness” of a thing has NOTHING to do with it’s impact on way and the improvements have been massive in just 6 months
someone mentally. Of course all of this is ignoring any potential I have gained a lot of muscle I look and feel so much better then
physical side effects or harm caused by certain substances/ I ever been.
behaviours but that’s not what this discussion is about so let’s
ignore it for now.

You can be addicted to anything. You can get addicted to sex,

porn, buying music, collecting rare books, rubbing balloons on

15
 There are also other aspects of my life that they have helped I wouldn’t say AVN’s are a bad thing for me infact I think it’s
so overall I say there are definitely many good aspects in AVN, a positive thing. I’m a pretty introvert and shy person always
well that is depending on what you’re playing because if you’re have been. Now I never not been happy because of something
playing a full on porn balls to the wall AVN you aren’t going to missing from my life id say im a pretty carefree and bubbly
learn much but you get my point. person, so it takes alot for me to not feel happy or angry. Hell
—u/gachagamer445 I don’t know if I have ever felt depressed either and if I have I
didn’t know I was.
They’re not inherently good or bad. It’s how they’re used that
matters, like any tool. When I started playing AVN’s it honestly started to impact me
more positive than negative . Because playing them getting to
—u/Player1Mario
know these virtual girls even tho I know they aren’t real or w/e
and I do think about some of them once a week or more. But the
connection I made to some of these LI it feels like it’s something
that Ive been missing and makes me feel things I normally never
feel.

Because of AVN’s it does motivate me to do things I have been

neglecting alot and better myself, like working out , eat healtier
food not as often stuff like that. Now why I also say it has had a
negative effect on me. Well it’s because alot of these games take
place in college or high school, an era im past in my life. It makes
me have alot of regret from time to time wishing I could redo
that phase of my life. Hell even seeing a successful MC gives me
moments of regret.

The only other negative impact is im borderline addicted to

AVN’s but I can say that about any video game or tv show I
get into as well. As it’s all that’s on my mind at times like what
AVN am i going to play next , what is going to happen next etc
etc. But I’d say i’m more addicted to AVN’s compared to other
forms of entertainment because I find it easier to get into the
characters or story or just get more entertainment / enjoyment
from them.

Overall I say AVN’s are more positive than negative to me. I get
more enjoyment out of them then I have from tv , video games
in a long time. I don’t find myself bored and not knowing what
to do or what to play next with AVN’s that often. While with
video games I get in a video game rut once in awhile especially
after playing a really good one. Where nothing sounds fun and
I feel bored for a day or 2 and I just watch random tv or anime
despite having a backlog of steam games. Now if I was addicted
to AVN’s where it affected me then id say it’s negative but it’s
not any worse than video games or tv only difference is I think
about them more often than I should.
—u/Dessolos

Top to Bottom: Jasmine (Race of Life), Mora (Bare Witness), Cece x James (Leap of Faith)

16
I can’t answer if it’s good for people who are struggling but I will
say that I think this games are good for men overall.

I started my journey with College Kings over 2 years ago and I

was just horny and it was a free sex game on steam... However,
I quickly realized that this is far more than just a porn simulator,
these are great stories. I then started a Youtube channel where I
play these games because I wanted to show people that this is
CLICK HERE
pretty much “Beverly Hills”+uncensored sex, great dramas with to see more of this thread

a lot of interpersonal conflict. Something a man isn’t allowed to

enjoy because of stigma, a *man* needs guns, a *man* need fast
cars, a man etc.

Putting it together with sex scenes gives us an excuse (for now)

to enjoy this type of media until it is more acceptable that men
wants to enjoy heartbreaking stories with little to no action.
Of course I’m inflating my explanation to drive my point home
but I still think this opinion is valid and correct.

Also, something you don’t see in other media is the actual sex,
sometimes you see in a comedy series that someone is tied
up in the bed with a ballgag while the wife holds a whip but
that is mostly for the laughs. When we see something like that
in an AVN we get an even deeper understanding of the people
involved, either something like their *philosophy of the world*
or something like “*this is who they are when they can be alone
with someone that they love and trust above everything else”.*

And that is beautiful, it does come down to the skill level of the
writer however and whether or not it is meant to be a fetish only
or if they also want to tell a story with the sex scenes.
—u/CarbonScythe0

The DIKs (Being a DIK)

17
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AVNL TIMES
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